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Heroes 3.11 "The Eclipse, Part II" Spoiler Discussion Thread

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  • Heroes 3.11 "The Eclipse, Part II" Spoiler Discussion Thread

    Since no-one else has, I'll get the party started.

    I was deeply concerned about the direction the show was taking as recently as four weeks ago. But this two-parter was terrific and, at least for me, really has the show back on track. They bought back some of the things that concerned me most (especially Sylar's unconvincingly rapid redemption) which counts for a lot. It was really good to see Hiro finally mattering again (and providing a little comic relief in the process).

    I'm not entirely sure why Sylar needed to kill Elle since he already has her power and she wanted to be with him. Is it that he's stopped feeling the need to control his "hunger"? Kind of a rape/power thing to underscore that he's definitely foresworn redemption?

    Seth Green's guest star turn was fun, if not terribly consequential.
    Cordially,
    Amuk

    I didn't jump. I took a tiny step, and there conclusions were.
    Addicted to Buffy

  • #2
    Good episode, more or less.

    Claire and Bennet -- I'm getting a little tired of this storyline. Reconcile or have done with each other. Claire, you know what he is. You've seen enough. He'll do anything, very literally, to protect his family. And you realize, even if he doesn't, that that's not an excuse for everything. But please don't act like you're traumatized to see yourself being given to him -- you know you started out as an assignment.

    Peter, Nathan, and the Haitian -- very cool to see the Haitian have stuff to do in this episode. And it was cool that he made Peter admit his real motivations. I was a little surprised to see Nathan's jump in reasoning, but at least it's in line with his arc this season and his post-shooting obsession with saving or changing the world. His thinking is way off, but his motivation is where it should be for what's happened to him.

    I'm ready for Peter to have his powers back. Or at least his empathic mimicry back so he can start over acquiring powers.

    Parkman and Daphne -- they are still very cute.

    Hiro and Ando -- This was pretty entertaining. Seth Green and Breckin Meyer were a nice change of pace. I also must say, the scene of Hiro grabbing Sylar, then Elle, then Claire, was great. Sylar's face when Hiro just appears is so funny. And then Noah and Sandra are like "what the hell?"

    Sylar and Elle -- I guess this means no spinoff, lol. Y'know, I'm not sure about this whole arc. For one thing, them hooking up felt like serious fanservice. Then to just kill Elle, probably the *only* character they've added to the cast since Season 1 to really capture the audience, is a pretty dubious idea. I mean, they couldn't just exile her into guest star land? Get an episode out of Kristen Bell in Season 3 or Season 4? Kristen Bell gives some of the best pain and fear on TV, and that pitiful whimper as she's cut open is probably the most painful.

    But at least no more debating over Sylar being evil. There was no hunger, there was no lust for power, there was just an evil man who decided trying to be good wasn't going to be entertaining enough. So he killed the only woman who actually seemed to care about him (he tends to do that).
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    • #3
      I am going to be the negative guy and just say I am done...

      Why on earth did Sylar need to kill Elle? We had two perfect deaths - Claire and Sylar. Yes I knew Claire was gunna live cause apperently Hayden Pattenires is the greatest thing on the show... But Sylar. Come on, he was an uber cool villian from season 1, a subpar villian in season 2 and a usless hero/villian in season 3. CUT HIM OFF. He should have died at the end of season 1! There was no reason for him to live... NONE!

      This would have opened up a great storyline for Elle to go on a Kill Bill style vengeance on HRG and Claire. We would have finally got a worth wild storyline... Why did Sylar need to kill her? The two of them made a great team and I understand Kristen Bell not being around the full season, but the two of them coulda gone in hiding or something for awhile...

      No, instead we get a storyline of the two most overused and useless characters... Claire and Hiro! WOOoOoOot! I can't wait for that! No... I am sick of Hiro. This whole 10-year-old thing isn't working... He is switching from adult to child to adult like mannerisums and speech, and why is he able to use his powers so fast? It took Hiro forever in season 1 to do so... The one thing I did like though was that Hiro didn't wanna grow up, and the shot of comic Charlie. It was nice to remember that Hiro has been on a long path... But yeah a long path that sucked starting season 2.

      So rather then working with new characters we will get just rehash of old characters...

      The Daphne stuff was... well... I dunno. I don't hate her character anymore. She is this weird thing on the show that isn't crappy, but not amazing... I dunno I DUNNO!

      But besides that... I think Heroes is totally forgetting that it needs to actually do something interesting...

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      • #4
        Bleh. Watching has been like a chore. I wish I could give up on it but once I start with a show I feel like I have to finish it out. Sometimes that dedication pays off. Like with Prison Break which is actually really pretty good this season. And sometimes it just doesn't. Like with Heroes and to a lesser extent Grey's Anatomy. I would like to say I am done but I have this sick compulsion to see things out.

        They seriously need to expel half the cast. There's just too much uninteresting crap going on. And they kill Adam and presumably Elle--like the only two newish characters I like?! And they keep all these others? I'm sorry, I don't care how integral to the mythos Claire and her stupid whiny teenage blood is....she's excess baggage.
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        • #5
          Originally posted by Jenni Lou View Post
          Bleh. Watching has been like a chore. I wish I could give up on it but once I start with a show I feel like I have to finish it out. Sometimes that dedication pays off. Like with Prison Break which is actually really pretty good this season. And sometimes it just doesn't. Like with Heroes and to a lesser extent Grey's Anatomy. I would like to say I am done but I have this sick compulsion to see things out.
          Yeah same. I say I give up, but next Monday I will be watching Heroes... I just need to kind of know what happends. I've spent 2 years invested in this show to just stop and it sucks... It is the same way I felt about Veronica Mars season 3. I couldn't give up, but I felt so forced when watching episodes...

          They seriously need to expel half the cast. There's just too much uninteresting crap going on. And they kill Adam and presumably Elle--like the only two newish characters I like?! And they keep all these others? I'm sorry, I don't care how integral to the mythos Claire and her stupid whiny teenage blood is....she's excess baggage.
          Yes! Mohinder and Maya (who by the way was such a waste... She is a series regular and had a 3-second cameo...) can easily just be cut loose. And Claire is just... She was cool at first when people could relate to her as a teenager going through something like this, but now she is a 16 year old who looks 20 who DOESN'T EVEN GO TO SCHOOL or act like a normal teen... It is rather annoying. Even Buffy acted like a teenager which made her more interesting of a character. Which is why I think Monica should be brought back. She was the perfect balance that Claire once was.

          Originally posted by KingofCretins View Post
          Good episode, more or less.
          Peter, Nathan, and the Haitian -- very cool to see the Haitian have stuff to do in this episode. And it was cool that he made Peter admit his real motivations. I was a little surprised to see Nathan's jump in reasoning, but at least it's in line with his arc this season and his post-shooting obsession with saving or changing the world. His thinking is way off, but his motivation is where it should be for what's happened to him.
          I totally forgot about them! This story I did like, well only because the Haitian rocks, it was cool too see that he was a deeper character and had alot of issues of his own. Plus his power to kill was pretty wicked! Have we seem him that violent before? I don't remember.

          I'm ready for Peter to have his powers back. Or at least his empathic mimicry back so he can start over acquiring powers.
          Hmm... I dunno about this. I like normalPeter... though personally I would rather Peter be killed in battle

          Kristen Bell gives some of the best pain and fear on TV, and that pitiful whimper as she's cut open is probably the most painful.
          Yes, Kristen Bell has that talent to feel for her character. She could be a mass murderer and if she cried I would totally feel bad for her and not for the people she killed... She so could get away with Murder! I felt so bad for Elle, what a way to go... pindowned and just destroyed

          But at least no more debating over Sylar being evil. There was no hunger, there was no lust for power, there was just an evil man who decided trying to be good wasn't going to be entertaining enough. So he killed the only woman who actually seemed to care about him (he tends to do that).
          This is true, so now hopefully we will get some oldschool Sylar and done of this whimpy Gabrial crap we've gotten for the last few weeks.
          DigitalLeonardo
          Somebody Save Me...
          Last edited by DigitalLeonardo; 02-12-08, 07:43 PM.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by DigitalLeonardo View Post
            This is true, so now hopefully we will get some oldschool Sylar and done of this whimpy Gabrial crap we've gotten for the last few weeks.
            haha, one of the few things I have been liking is the wimpy Gabriel crap. Don't know why I guess I just feel like it gives Zachary Quinto more to than just
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            • #7
              Originally posted by DigitalLeonardo View Post
              I totally forgot about them! This story I did like, well only because the Haitian rocks, it was cool too see that he was a deeper character and had alot of issues of his own. Plus his power to kill was pretty wicked! Have we seem him that violent before? I don't remember.
              We've seen him kick a little ass, but not use his power aggressively like that other than when he kidnapped Parkman waaaaay back in Season 1. And I don't even know if he killed them necessarily.

              Hmm... I dunno about this. I like normalPeter... though personally I would rather Peter be killed in battle
              See, I really disagree with this. Hiro, Peter, and Claire, for better or worse, are the core of this show. You could no sooner write them out and go on than you could do "Buffy" without the Scoobies. They all stand for different archetypes of heroism. Plus, it is and always was crap that Peter is basically the *only* person whose powers have to keep getting taken away for long stretches. It's no problem for Arthur or Sylar to have all that power, but not Peter. Although, (spoiler for the TV preview of 3.12)
              Spoiler:
              when Peter is saying something to his dad he appears to be holding out his hand in his typical "I'm about to zap you or TK you or through fire at you" gesture.


              Yes, Kristen Bell has that talent to feel for her character. She could be a mass murderer and if she cried I would totally feel bad for her and not for the people she killed... She so could get away with Murder! I felt so bad for Elle, what a way to go... pindowned and just destroyed
              It wasn't the whimper so much as her saying "you're hurting me" -- her voice sort of admits that she knows it's not an accident.

              This is true, so now hopefully we will get some oldschool Sylar and done of this whimpy Gabrial crap we've gotten for the last few weeks.
              Originally posted by Jenni Lou View Post
              haha, one of the few things I have been liking is the wimpy Gabriel crap. Don't know why I guess I just feel like it gives Zachary Quinto more to than just
              I'm in the middle on Wimpy Gabriel Crap -- I think Quinto is a strong actor, but mostly I don't *believe* Wimpy Gabriel Crap. The only moment that his wimpy crap really worked for me was at the start of Season 2, when he hitches a ride with Maya and Alejandro. She asks his name, he looks at his broken watch and the name Sylar, and then just whispers that his name is Gabriel. That actually made his deep issues all the more clear -- his need to be special, his insecurity.
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              • #8
                Last episode Noah Bennet was already laying in the backyard ready to shoot while Sylar and Elle just began with their kiss session. And he didn't shoot until after they finished the sex, why did Noah do that? Did he seriously laying there waiting for Elle and Sylar to finish the sex first.

                I'm not sure what to thinkabout Elle's death. Sylar not having a reason to crack her skull and the lack of Elle's body give me the reason that she isn't dead yet. But maybe it's just wishful thinking. And did they drop the little Noah story? Because if that one is still happening, Noah needs to be born this year to fit in the timeline. And in that case I suspect that Elle is the mother (maybe baby Sylar heals her? [/ more wishful thinking]).

                Nathan drive me nuts, one arc I love the guy and the next arc I want him gone. The same with Peter who was great this episode, which is the first time in a long time.

                I'm tired of special Claire and her whiny story. And she is still just 16 years old?

                10 years old Hiro doesn't work for me, the scary thing is that the young Hiro is not much more childish and annoying than the grown up version. Ando remains amazing and I love the comicshop guys. Matt and Daphne are cute but really boring.

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                • #9
                  I'm just gonna chime in on the death of Elle.

                  It was something I was prepared for since...last week? The week before? When NBC leaked a promo picture of a Sylar'd!Elle on the beach (buncha dipshits). At first, I was shocked and couldn't believe that they dared to kill off Kristen Bell. Then I accepted it and moved on.

                  Quite honestly, for me Elle's character went straight to crap the second she got over Sylar being the guy who murdered her father and decided to start lovin' him and wanting to be with him and blahblahblah. Sylar/Elle, for me, is the most prepostrous relationship on the show simply because it is so rushed that they move from sworn enemies to sworn love buddies in the span of a SINGLE scene.

                  From there, Elle has done nothing but flipflop. "You're a good man, Gabriel!" "You're evil, Gabriel, just go with it!" "You're a good man, Gabriel!" "KILL! KILL! KILL!" I'm so sick of it! I wanted to SCREAM last night when Elle was with Sylar and was egging him on and saying he was a bad guy and that they were both bad guys and blahblahblah. This was written by the SAME guys who wrote last week's episode - and in that one, Elle was on a completely different side of this debate! What. The. Eff.

                  Now, I love Kristen Bell and she is not the problem here. She made the most of the storyline she was given. She really did. She went above and beyond and put everyone around her to shame. Clearly, she is not the problem.

                  Elle's the problem. The CHARACTER is the problem. The writers screwed her over just to, as KingofCretins said, please the fans and possibly even just to please the actors (Zach Quinto and Kristen Bell have been besties for a decade).

                  Killing Elle proves two things:

                  A) The writers might just know how to impact their characters better than anybody would've thought. And I don't just mean for the shock factor. Elle's death will set Sylar down an evil path...for the next episode or so.

                  B) They're not afraid to kill people off. THANK GOD. Everyone knows that Elle salvaged the sinking ship that was season 2. Everybody knows that Kristen Bell is a beloved actress on the show. Killing her off is one step closer to proving that nobody is safe. One step closer to making death on "Heroes" as meaningful and shocking as death on "Lost." The next step would be killing off one of the core three - Claire, Hiro, or Peter. Their deaths would solidify the idea that everybody is fair game. Hopefully one of them will die in Volume 4.

                  However, here is a spoiler that I just read that...yeah...

                  *Spoiler concerning the death of Elle*

                  Spoiler:
                  Originally posted by Kristin Dos Santos, E!Online
                  As I told you last week, a blond Hero who's in a new relationship is getting killed, but I've since learned that despite many signs pointing to that Hero's death, all is not lost. There's a cover-up at work, and she may well rise from the dead. Holler!
                  Well, now I'm a little pissed. Because this completely ruins what I was hoping for concerning the writers actually getting their act together. UGGHHH! Seriously?! Kill Elle. PROVE YOURSELVES! Just because some immature little bitches are screaming that they're gonna stop watching because Elle's dead (which means they shouldn't be watching the show anyway since, ya know, she's had such a minor role until recently), doesn't mean that you need to change what's set in motion!

                  UGGHH! These writers! They have NO integrity whatsoever!

                  And a cover-up? I swear to god, if they go with the idea that Sylar kills Tracy and uses her body to pose as Elle's...I will cry. Not only because I love Ali Larter and no harm shall come to her and because she is the most unexplored character on the show who has had no storyline whatsoever...BUT ALSO BECAUSE it is absolutely absurd. Dental records, anyone? How about major height differences - Ali being 5'8" and Kristen being 5'1"?

                  UGGHHH!


                  ANYWAYYYYY...
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                  • #10
                    Sorry, but I'm just mad at "Heroes".

                    Hiro/Ando/Comic Book Freaks: Eh. Hiro as a ten year old is horrible, IMO, and I can't stand him. But Ando is still awesome, and Seth Green did a fantastic job with his little speech So, some entertaining stuff, but seriously, let ten year old Hiro GO!

                    Matt/Daphne: Interesting twist. I like their convos in here. Daphne and Matt are great together, and have probably the best arc this year. Daphne's really growing on me, and I really hope they don't kill her off. PLEASE kill Claire, Hiro, Peter, or Sylar. Oh, Sylar. PLEASE kill Sylar. PLEASE.

                    Peter/Nathan/Haitian: I'm really going to go against the grain and say that this was my least favorite part of the episode. Everything felt so filler, and I hated it. Why did they go and fight the Haitian's brother? What was the point? It didn't help them. And how does Nathan know frech??? He was speaking in French randomly. This whole part was boring and useless, IMO. Boo.

                    Claire/Sandra: Oh, Mama!Bennet!!! She did an amazing job in this episode, and then Claire died. I knew she was coming back, but it was nice for a moment....otherwise, her annoying arguments with her dad are just old by now. *shrugs*

                    Tracey: Oh, wait, there was none

                    Noah/Sylar/Elle: Wow. Jerks. Elle and Noah are the best, and I get what Heather is saying, but I'm sorry: there is no way I can not stop loving this character. And it's probably because of Kristen Bell. Sylar, on the other hand, just gets increasingly crappy. Noah's shooting at them was intense and when Noah slit Sylar's throat :eek: I thought it was for frakking real, and I was so shocked and so happy. And it was all for nothing. It was a fake out and then they went and killed Elle. But I got over it

                    Overall, I think this episode was....okay, I guess. This season is not thrilling me as much as Season 2, which was a huge step down from Season 1. I hope they get back on track. I'm not saying this just because I'm mad about Elle, cause I got all that anger out last night I'm just pissed at a lot of the other plots. This show just isn't fun anymore, but I can't just suddenly stop cause I'm so invested in it. I keep coming back to it. I guess the writers must be doing something right then...right?

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                    • #11
                      *claps for Heather*

                      Originally posted by Heather View Post
                      From there, Elle has done nothing but flipflop. "You're a good man, Gabriel!" "You're evil, Gabriel, just go with it!" "You're a good man, Gabriel!" "KILL! KILL! KILL!" I'm so sick of it! I wanted to SCREAM last night when Elle was with Sylar and was egging him on and saying he was a bad guy and that they were both bad guys and blahblahblah.
                      Well....Elle has always been a bit off, imo. She was a teeny bit crazy in S2. The way she was raised and how she was never really valued by anyone sort of turned into a bit of automaton. Clearly, she has has moments where she has broken free from that path and her arc this season has shown her to be much different than she was last season. However, she was always a bit grey in the whole evil scheme of things. Neither good nor bad....she flip-flopped sides a lot. We saw the flashback where she met good Gabriel and how conflicted she felt about her mission; we saw her buddy-buddy with Claire for an ever so brief stint and it seemed she was trying to do the right thing, even if it was a selfish to ploy to end her own pain. And then there are all those times that she just did plain old bad things. So, I have to say, honestly I don't feel like her flip-flopping on Sylar was all that OOC. She has some serious trust issues stemming from the way her father raised her. Sylar may have killed him, yes. But her father is also partly responsible for turning Sylar into what he is. So in an ironic way he is almost not responsible for killing him in the first place. (Of course he is culpable! I'm just making a point that Elle has reasons for her flip-floppiness. )



                      I'm actually more pissed about Adam's death. Only because they brought him back for like a single episode and for what?! That?! Are you kidding me?! Sheer lameness, man. Booooo!
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                      • #12
                        Honestly, I'm not that mad about Elle being killed. Kristen Bell didn't want to commit to anything. I don't really think they should plan around Kristen Bell's schedule. If killing Elle means we get old Sylar back, then cool. Plus, like Heather said, they killed off a much loved character. And I say about effing time!

                        And I don't see the big deal with Wimpy!Sylar. I'd be more annoyed if Sylar remained the same character all this time... At least he's getting explored and we're seeing various sides of him. I think that's a good thing, honestly.

                        I think the Haitian killing his brother could have some significance if that's where they're taking Nathan and Peter. When the Haitian was all, "This is my fight." If Nathan starts to get really evil, it'll be Peter's job to stop him. At least that's what I got from it.

                        Moving on to HRG, Claire was right to be pissed. She was dyeing, there was no way for them to know that when the eclipse was gone, there powers would return and Claire would heal. Instead, he went after Elle and Sylar instead of being at his dying daughter's side. And HRG going after them had nothing to do with the mission. It was revenge, simple as that.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Thomas View Post
                          Honestly, I'm not that mad about Elle being killed. Kristen Bell didn't want to commit to anything. I don't really think they should plan around Kristen Bell's schedule. If killing Elle means we get old Sylar back, then cool. Plus, like Heather said, they killed off a much loved character. And I say about effing time!

                          And I don't see the big deal with Wimpy!Sylar. I'd be more annoyed if Sylar remained the same character all this time... At least he's getting explored and we're seeing various sides of him. I think that's a good thing, honestly.

                          I think the Haitian killing his brother could have some significance if that's where they're taking Nathan and Peter. When the Haitian was all, "This is my fight." If Nathan starts to get really evil, it'll be Peter's job to stop him. At least that's what I got from it.
                          I'm happy that Heroes got the strength to finally kill off a character; first time since Isaac in Season 1. But, why did they choose to kill a character that was highly praised? I'm really glad that Sylar is coming back, though (the evil one, I mean). So, now I'm kind of on the edge. They finally killed off a character and we get evil Sylar, but a character I loved was just killed off. I want Heroes to get the strength to kill off a big character, but at least choose wisely. Mohinder, who is just this scientist who's turned into evil!Spiderman and who almost no one really likes, has a reason to be killed. *shrugs*

                          I don't like Wimpy!Sylar, because I just don't buy his turn. In one minute, he's become good.

                          I thought the only point of the Haitian storyline was to make Nathan go on another side of the argument. I don't think Peter will kill Nathan, honestly. I just think they're going to fight. And to see Haitian kill his brother wasn't necesarry, even if it was forshadowing. It took up two episodes of plot for the brothers, which could be used with the Primatech story and maybe have some Tracey in there.

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                          • #14
                            ELLE and SYLER: So, I thought this two parter was a good episode... not great, but good. I'm just in utter shock. And I guess you guys know why... YES! MY GIRL ELLE... DEAD! I couldn't believe it that they killed her off. I have to deal with it and I will be watching the show, but I'll miss it. The thing that made me mad about Elle's dead is THE WAY SHE DIED!!! It wasn't like her to just lie down and die. It made me mad that they made her go out that way. I wished they would have at least made her death bad ass! She will be missed, her character was awesome and more dimensional than the others.

                            Syler is just irritating me. He is just there just to be there. Like Travis stated. He was great in season one... Now he has to go. To me he's annoying and useless and like an annoying fly on the wall.
                            -------------
                            HIRO and ANDO: Hiro is just annoying me. Him being 10 is just stupid in my head. I don’t know why this is accruing... What is the reason of him being ten. Like really... come on! Surprisingly, Ando doesn’t annoy me.
                            --------------
                            MATT and DAPHNE: I love these too and I love they're storyline. I think they are cute together, but it's just weird because they moved very fast in they're relationship. Seeing Daphne's weakness was great. I like how she wouldn't walk without her abilities.
                            -------------
                            CLAIRE: Why does everything center around her! I like the character, don’t get me wrong, but god damn! I thought this episode was great for her. I loved the almost dying and her not being able to heal. I think maybe this will show her that she isn’t all ways hurt proof, or death proof. I think she will grow alot from this and stop rushing into stupid situations.
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                            BLAHHHH!!!!
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                            • #15
                              Claire/Sandra/Noah: I've never disliked Noah more than this episode. First he watched Elle and Sylar having sex (I can fanwank it that he just lost his shot when they dropped to the floor, but, still?might want to be a little clearer on that point, show), then he completely abandons Claire in her moment of need. I always loved Noah because of how much he loved his family, but he lost major points in that department this episode. Claire was great, Sandra was stunning.

                              Noah/Sylar: But, still, Badass!Noah is freaking awesome. The man has some very dark portions of his soul. I hope we someday get a peak into his past. It's also pretty twisted that Noah slitting his throat made Sylar respect him all the more. Now Sylar wants to be Noah when he grows up!

                              Sylar/Elle: I read a theory over at TWP that the Elle on the beach wasn't Elle, and Sylar knew it. That the Elle on the beach was a illusionist, like that chick Candice. It kind of makes sense, because my first thought when Elle appeared was, "Why on earth did Hiro send them both to the same place?", but then when the killing started I forgot about my question. Looking back, though, there was something very off about that scene. Elle didn't even try to use her powers once? I think not. I think Elle is somewhere on the other side of the world, worrying about Gabriel, and that there's a third party edging into the fray. I hope that, at least, because I loved Elle, and I really hope little Noah ends up being born. As much as the process of redemption is being mishandled, I still like the end result. I still have hope that the Gabriel in the future will happen. At the same time, though, I also take great hope that this episode has revealed that Sylar is not (thank God) a Petrelli!

                              Peter/Nathan/Hatian: Nathan is still my least favorite character. Peter is still one of my least favorite characters. Great to see the Hatian getting some screentime. Is The Hatian's brother immune to his brother's powers? Kind of like Scott Summers and his brothers?

                              Matt/Daphne: I love Matt, he's one of my favorite characters. And I love Daphne. But I don't like them together as much as I could. I still believe that Daphne and Hiro would be better.

                              Hiro/Ando/Matt: I loved the visit to the comic book store. This is some of Hiro's best stuff in the entire series. I like Hiro no matter what, pretty much. I like his 10 year old persona as much as his adult persona. Almost more, because, if anything, he's even more of a pure hero. I love how comic books and comic book geeks are sort of like Oracles.

                              Pinehearst Crew: Arthur reveals himself to be a whiney bitch without powers, while Peter turns into an action hero. I think the outcome of this game is pretty clear. Mohinder was pretty good this episode, though his storyline still doesn't interest me in the slightest.

                              Hiro/Claire: This is a very intriguing set-up! I just know that these two together, in the past, with Noah, are going to rock very hardcore.

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                              • #16
                                Originally posted by XavierZane View Post
                                Sylar/Elle: I read a theory over at TWP that the Elle on the beach wasn't Elle, and Sylar knew it. That the Elle on the beach was a illusionist, like that chick Candice. It kind of makes sense, because my first thought when Elle appeared was, "Why on earth did Hiro send them both to the same place?", but then when the killing started I forgot about my question. Looking back, though, there was something very off about that scene. Elle didn't even try to use her powers once? I think not. I think Elle is somewhere on the other side of the world, worrying about Gabriel, and that there's a third party edging into the fray. I hope that, at least, because I loved Elle, and I really hope little Noah ends up being born. As much as the process of redemption is being mishandled, I still like the end result. I still have hope that the Gabriel in the future will happen. At the same time, though, I also take great hope that this episode has revealed that Sylar is not (thank God) a Petrelli!

                                God, I hope you're right. I have to agree with you that her death was strange and like I siad before Elle would've fought back and not just laid there like last time. Also I was thinking the last time Syler tried to kill Elle she had that power surge. She didnt have any bults running through her when Syler was killer her. I just he she isnt dead.
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                                • #17
                                  Good point about the Elle death, XavierZane! Someone came up with a good theory on that. 'Cause I wondering as well why Hiro brought the both to the same place. It seemed odd to me but I just dismissed it because--let's face it--there's plenty of sloppy writing on this show.
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                                  • #18
                                    Originally posted by Jenni Lou View Post
                                    Good point about the Elle death, XavierZane! Someone came up with a good theory on that. 'Cause I wondering as well why Hiro brought the both to the same place. It seemed odd to me but I just dismissed it because--let's face it--there's plenty of sloppy writing on this show.
                                    Too true, which is why I try to avoid complex theories like the above. In general, the fans are thinking about it way way more than the writers. Still, I would love it if the writers showed some subtlety for once! However, if this is truly the return of villainous Sylar, then it's pretty well-done. He already had her powers, so her murder was simply for pleasure rather than power. That's a step further than the point he was at even in season 1.

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                                    • #19
                                      BB- There was DC and Nikki who were both killed off (Okay Ali's still around but still).

                                      Haven't even seen the first part but I wanted to commented on what you guys were talking about (Thought it was going to go on a break after part 1).
                                      Well by the sounds of it Sylar is still not a good person, knew that was probably an act (Then again Angela's vision kinda proved it when all of them gathered around Arthur in the previous episode before the last).

                                      I got to say I think Hiro/Claire should both have less episodes, just for a little while so people like Traci can shine (I am seeing a pattern here....), aleast Parkman has been showing alot.

                                      Although I wish they didn't get rid of Micha and his cousin so fast (They could have made a good storyline out of that).

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                                      • #20
                                        I didn't see the entire episode. But I was so giddy to see Seth and Breckin that I couldn't wait to rewatch the show. Unfortunately, I was aghast when I saw Sylar killing Elle that I just turned the tv off and hoped that I had seen wrong. I really loved her character and losing her cuts just one more tie of my interest in the show.

                                        Originally posted by Thomas View Post
                                        Honestly, I'm not that mad about Elle being killed. Kristen Bell didn't want to commit to anything. I don't really think they should plan around Kristen Bell's schedule. If killing Elle means we get old Sylar back, then cool. Plus, like Heather said, they killed off a much loved character. And I say about effing time!
                                        Good point! Such a large show shouldn't have to work around a single actor. And yay for the show being able to kill a loved character. Tragedy is a vital emotion to a show.

                                        Originally posted by BlasterBoy View Post
                                        I'm happy that Heroes got the strength to finally kill off a character; first time since Isaac in Season 1. But, why did they choose to kill a character that was highly praised?
                                        That's my thought. Elle was loved. She was still considered a new character. Killing off a main original character is what the show still refuses to do. The show tries to have epic life/death storylines. But without important characters dying, its hard to understand the value of life and finality of death.


                                        Originally posted by Thomas
                                        And I don't see the big deal with Wimpy!Sylar. I'd be more annoyed if Sylar remained the same character all this time... At least he's getting explored and we're seeing various sides of him. I think that's a good thing, honestly.
                                        Originally posted by Blasterboys
                                        I'm really glad that Sylar is coming back, though (the evil one, I mean). So, now I'm kind of on the edge. They finally killed off a character and we get evil Sylar, but a character I loved was just killed off. I want Heroes to get the strength to kill off a big character, but at least choose wisely. Mohinder, who is just this scientist who's turned into evil!Spiderman and who almost no one really likes, has a reason to be killed. *shrugs*

                                        I don't like Wimpy!Sylar, because I just don't buy his turn. In one minute, he's become good.
                                        I haven't truly watched this season, but I agree that I didn't find Sylar's turn good very convincing. Which considering he just killed Elle, obviously he wasn't convincing because he actually wasn't good.

                                        I think a true turn of Sylar into understand other people have value equal to one's own desires might have been nice.

                                        Ha! Death to Mohinder!

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