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  • Yay or Nay to Season Eight?

    This thread is to discuss your thoughts on Season Eight. All of your likes to dislikes. From the covers to the plots, how do you feel about where the series is going? So bring on the buffy, and bring on the bad!

    I will start with the bad. Personally, i think the way dawn is a giant and changing is way to Fantasy. It didn't really fit into the way the element of the show feeled to me but others may disagree. Just my opinion, and the only other thing which isn't a big deal i find a nuisance. There are waaayyyyy to many different covers for the comics. I have a subsription to Buffy S8 and each month i get a different type of cover. I have had to hunt down the realistic looking covers which i prefer way more. I know i am just being picky and that it has nothing to do with the series but i think it would be better to just have all the issues looking realistic.

    Now for the good. Well first of all - BUFFY COMING BACK! i didn't think there was any way buffy would come back but somehow it did! I like the story arc idea's too. they're keeping it under the same basis that got us all hooked with a few surprises here and there they couldn't have done because of budget. Overall i am very happy! It's Buffy!
    52
    Love It!
    38.46%
    20
    Like It.
    38.46%
    20
    Don't Like It.
    11.54%
    6
    Hate It...
    11.54%
    6

  • #2
    I'm not sure what I think about it. I love the stories, but somehow I can't really feel the connection with the tv-series.

    I'll start with the good;
    I know that this isn't part of the story, but I love the covers ... those are stunning. The inside art, I'm not sure of ... they look too young. But it's very well painted.

    I loved Faith's story, from all the characters ... she felt the most like the character I knew. Besides, it was interesting to see how they dealed with a bad slayer.

    Good writing, it has some WTF? moments ... but right now, there is pretty good writing.

    There are some very interesting storylines coming. And not just the obvious questions; Who is Twilight and who betrays Buffy.

    Also, Xander has story ... *yay*


    Less *yay*;
    Like I already said at the start of this post; I have no connection with this story. If you see where we left them in Chosen and where they are now ... story and characters ... it doesn't feel the same. Also the fairytale swing has something to do with it. There happened a lot of weird things in the series (like Olaf), but season 8 brings the magic/weirdness to a whole new level. From the sleeping beauty to Dawn and how she looks to Willow on dreamtrips.
    It's not impossible or OOC ... I just can't feel the good old BtVS-vibe.

    Buffy is more likable in season 8 wich is great, but I still really don't enjoy her character. This is probably the fault of season 6 and 7 but the fact that she is entering the grey area is not making me fall in love with her again. If somebody enters that area, I need to know why, to understand it so I can accept it. And I've no idea why Buffy is doing what she is doing, and I can't see her point or understand it. So, I hope that there will be an explanation somewhere, but until then ... I'm a little meh on ms. Summers.

    The story goes slow and there are so many storylines (Yes, I'm 6 years old and after a year without real answers ... I'm bored). Is this going to be a season with in the first part of the season only questions and after that only answers? Because right now, I've so many questions ... and I'm afraid that I don't get all the answers. And all the arcs feel a little bit connectionless. The one moment we are looking how Faith and Giles are kicked out of the gang, the next moment we get Dracula (Xander's secret pal) in Japan and after that they are going to travel to the future. It doesn't feel like one big story and more like every writer can pick his/her own characters and can make up an own story.
    Last edited by Nina; 03-07-08, 08:59 PM.

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    • #3
      Haven't read issue 16 yet, but here are my answers:

      The Good:

      - I've read many S8 continuations and all were great, but there's something off about them that makes them not real to me. All dwell on the past events of the TV show, their aim is fix the un-fixed: character issues, loose plotlines, ship issues and do not move forward to new things.

      S8, on the other hand, did what every season did. It went ahead to new places, new plotlines, new characters, new developments for our characters. It rarely mentions the past and that's pure Buffy. How many times have we heard about Cordelia or Oz after they had left and they were main characters to the story in High School Years? The new elements and moving forward instead of dwelling on the past is what makes this a believable continuation for me than other S8 writings by fans.

      - Xander finally has a story!!!

      - Xander and Buffy's close friendship.

      - Buffy's thing with Satsu, it felt real for me.

      - The Faith arc and the Tokyo arc were amazing.


      The Bad:

      - The Warren retcon. I hate retcons, they ruin my enjoyment of the show, and I feel that Warren should have stayed dead, because his death was a great scene.

      -Xander's annoying uniform. Thankfully, he was wearing something else in #15. Also, Willow's dresses, I was beyond happy to see her wearing pants in #8 and #9.
      Made by Trickyboxes
      Halfrek gives Spike the curse that will change his entire life. Teenage Dirtbag

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Nina View Post
        I'm not sure what I think about it. I love the stories, but somehow I can't really feel the connection with the tv-series.

        I'll start with the good;
        I know that this isn't part of the story, but I love the covers ... they are stunning. The inside art, I'm not sure of ... they look too young. But it's very well painted.

        I loved Faith's story, from all the characters ... she felt the most like the character I knew. Besides, it was interesting to see how they dealed with a bad slayer.

        Good writing, it has some WTF? moments ... but right now, ther is pretty good writing.

        There are some very interesting storylines coming. And not just the obvious questions; Who is Twilight and who betrays Buffy.

        Also, Xander has story ... *yay*


        Less *yay*;
        Like I already said at the start of this post; I have no connection with this story. If you see where we left them in Chosen and where they are now ... story and characters ... it doesn't feel the same. Also the fairytale swing has something to do with it. There happened a lot of weird things in the series (like Olaf), but season 8 brings the magic/weirdness to a whole new level. From the sleeping beauty to Dawn and how she looks to Willow on dreamtrips.
        It's not impossible or OOC ... I just can't feel the good old BtVS-vibe.

        Buffy is more likable in season 8 wich is great, but I still really don't enjoy her character. This is probably the fault of season 6 and 7 but the fact that she is entering the grey area is not making me fall in love with her again. If somebody enters that area, I need to know why, to understand it so I accept it. And I've no idea why Buffy is doing what she is doing, and I can't see her point or understand it. So, I hope that there will be an explanation somewhere, but until then ... I'm a little meh on ms. Summers.

        The story goes slow and there are so many storylines (Yes, I'm 6 years old and after a year without real answers ... I'm bored). Is this going to be a season with in the first part of the season only questions and after that only answers? Because right now, I've so many questions ... and I'm afraid that I don't get all the answers. And all the arcs feel a little bit connectionless. The one moment we are looking how Faith and Giles are kicked out of the gang, the next moment we get Dracula (Xander's secret pal) in Japan and after that they are going to travel to the future. It doesn't feel like one big story and more like every writer can pick his/her own characters and can make up an own story.
        I totally agree with you Nina. The first covers that come out on stands are fantastic. And i'm glad im not the only one who feels that something is just off about season eight. It just doesn't really feel like what the show used to be. And i hope the whole story arcs are somehow connected in the end cuz i hate how they are randomly just jumping all over the place. And i still think the whole dawn changing thing is way to fantasy and dont even let me get started about the whole buffy/satsu thing goin on! I think season eight was under to much pressure to not ruin the show and live up to the fans expectations, and believe me they've tried.....but im just not sure if its completely on par. Dont get me wrong, i still love season eight and am ecstatic that buffy is back once more, but i just hope they can get it back under control. We'll see!

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        • #5
          I've only read the first five, and I may be biased because I'm really not a comic person (hence why I haven't bought any more than the first five!) but they do not compare at all to the tv series.

          I think because it's a comic and therefore less dynamic than anything on television, it's very easy to get carried away with the storylines, also as there's nothing you can't do, in terms of 'special effects' and that! I feel it's a bit over-dramatic, although it is nice that the story is continued I'll get the rest of them from somewhere and reply again when I'm more educated in the matter!

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          • #6
            The Good:
            A season 8? I went for a very long time thinking fans had tried to pick up where the show left off and therefore did not pay attention but then finding out that this is from Joss in the sense he produces and or writes made me do a dance because that meant new stories for Buffy and the gang!

            Joss dealing with the Girl in Question. I know that was technically an Angel thing since it was in his series, but I seriously had major issues about that whole episode. I could believe Joss would insult my intelligence and therefore was so happy he fixed it by having decoys. Thank you Joss for that!

            Others have said it but Xander having stories and being really involved, yay!

            Buffy showing glimpses of the Buffy I loved so much for so long.

            Again others have already mentioned: Faith Arc, Tokyo Arc...especially Dracula. I understand there is a lot of controversy surrounding him but in his last apperance, he was so bad ass...I loved him!

            Though physcially Dawn is um..weird I say thank God that she is still shwoing signs of strength and being the bad ass sister I always hoped she would be for Buffy.

            Twilight: Don't know much, happy about that, he is intriguing.

            Bad
            Love Willow but I am really confused with what is going on with her. I feel really stupid when we get into parts about her snake goddess or what was going on when she was being err...killed by Warren. I just feel like I am not smart enough to understand or that I missed something.

            Buffy/Satsu- has nothing to do with her being with a woman, more that even though it has ended nice...Buffy was still using her err... partner for what she needs. That makes me sad.

            No Giles/Buffy resolution or better yet explination on why things are the way they are between them. I hope we get some good info soon.

            Comment


            • #7
              Well, I was ok with the finale of the show, except with Spike dying, since I'm a spuffy fan, but all in all it was a good finale for me, I don't think season 8 was necessary. But Joss did it, and having more Buffy is always a "yay!" and it's supposed to be cannon.

              Another "yay" is that they deal with what happened in "The girl in question", I just rewatched that episode yesterday and it really did not make any sence, it was funny though. I also like that Buffy seems a little more happy than in previous seasons or at least more calmed, I like that Buffy and Xander are on really good friendly terms and that we'll have...

              Spoiler:
              Oz coming back, I always wondered what had happened with his character


              A "nay" for me, it's the relationship with Satsu, don't like Buffy using someone like that again. And the thing with Willow, I'm not really understanding her storyline. Another "nay" is Dracula & Xander's relashionship, don't get me wrong, I like Dracula and I like Xander but the relashionship there seems a bit out of character for me.
              avatar credit: me!!

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              • #8
                Originally posted by lara View Post
                Another "yay" is that they deal with what happened in "The girl in question", I just rewatched that episode yesterday and it really did not make any sence, it was funny though.
                The reason almost nobody understood ''the girl in question'' when they watched it was becuase most fans weren't aware of the buffy novel ''The Queen of the Slayers''. It was written by Nancy Holder and Joss gave it the go ahead and they announced it canon. Most fans weren't aware of this though because the population of buffy fans that read buffy books was quite low at the time after the series had ended. It tied up a lot of stuff that happened in season five of angel and it would still be worthwhile for everyone to read becuase it is an amazing story and tied up the whole buffy angel series. But then joss started the comics and had to announce the book as non-canon! You should still read it though!

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by TheChosen View Post
                  The reason almost nobody understood ''the girl in question'' when they watched it was becuase most fans weren't aware of the buffy novel ''The Queen of the Slayers''. It was written by Nancy Holder and Joss gave it the go ahead and they announced it canon.
                  Joss announced it canon where exactly? I've never seen that anywhere.
                  "Occasionally, I'm callous and strange..." - Willow Rosenberg, "Buffy the Vampire Slayer"

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Rowan Hawthorn View Post
                    Joss announced it canon where exactly? I've never seen that anywhere.
                    The book came out a few years back and he announced it canon at the time of the release, but now that he is making Buffy Season Eight and Angel: After the Fall he had to announce it non-canon. Unfortunately, when the book was released, angel had also ended and not many fans were reading the books anymore and most people were unaware of this new attachment to the series. But if you don't want to read it anymore you dont have to because it isn't canon anymore! Sorry for the confusion!

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by TheChosen View Post
                      The book came out a few years back and he announced it canon at the time of the release, but now that he is making Buffy Season Eight and Angel: After the Fall he had to announce it non-canon. Unfortunately, when the book was released, angel had also ended and not many fans were reading the books anymore and most people were unaware of this new attachment to the series. But if you don't want to read it anymore you dont have to because it isn't canon anymore! Sorry for the confusion!
                      I've read it, back when it was first released. What I've never read is anything where Joss - or anyone, actually, except for a few fans - ever said it was canon. I know some people assumed that all the tie-in novels were canon because Joss and Fox "approved" them, but that was just to make sure that the authors didn't get too carried away (one author said that, as long as their storyline didn't impinge on anything that Joss actually had planned, they could do pretty much whatever they wanted with the understanding that they had to "put the toys back in the box afterwards" - i.e., make sure that they left the Buffyverse where it was when they started.)
                      "Occasionally, I'm callous and strange..." - Willow Rosenberg, "Buffy the Vampire Slayer"

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                      • #12
                        Have you read Dark Congress by Christopher Golden? That's another good book? You should also join the ''Reader's of the Buffy Books Group''. Its a group to discuss all the books, comics or anything to do with buffy really in book-type format!

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                        • #13
                          I love season eight, as I've already said numerous times, if this were on TV I think it would be one of the best seasons ever, just behind season three and two IMO. I love it, its only impairment is that it is a comic book, which is great for the epic stuff, but obviously I'd prefer it if it was televised. But story-wise, one of the best seasons ever.

                          The yay:

                          Buffy/Xander/Willow bonding. It's go grea that Joss remembers how important these three are and the friendship isn't neglected like it was in later seasons, it's back and as strong as ever and that's really cool.

                          Xander gets a story which is fantastic. He was sidelined from season3/season 4 and was never given the atteniton he deserves again. Finally he's getting a story again, proving he isn't a boring character as some suggested.

                          Buffy's very likeable again. Even with her morally grey actions this season she's still written far better than she was in season six and in particular season seven. She's witty, whimsy, can be tough and tender at the same time and is nice to her friends, it's what made her so iconic in the first place.

                          Twilight is a big bad who actually poses a serious threat and who isn't all talk like the First was. Best big bad since Glory IMO.

                          The writing is more quippy, quirky and fun than it was in the last two seasons of the show, and IMO even since season three. It lost some of it's spark in later years, in particular season 7 and I think it's back to its glory days.

                          The new slayers are likeable and in no way annoying like the potentials of the season before...

                          The Nay:

                          Comic Book. Seriously it's grown on me a great deal and I don't even notice it now. But of course I'd rather this be televised, but that's never going to happen so I don't judge the season on it, like I said I think the stories are amazing.

                          Absent Giles: Just cause I love Giles. I want to see more of him, but both Joss and Allie have said he's most certainly coming back, which I suspected anyway, so hopefully this won't be a nay for long.

                          ~ Banner by Nina ~

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by TheChosen View Post
                            Have you read Dark Congress by Christopher Golden? That's another good book? You should also join the ''Reader's of the Buffy Books Group''. Its a group to discuss all the books, comics or anything to do with buffy really in book-type format!
                            I don't think I've read that one, but I've read most of the books. I wasn't really impressed with any of them, I'm afraid. I was especially disappointed in the "Wicked Willow" series. I'd read Navarro's script adaptations ("The Willow Files") and thought she had about the best handle on the voices of any of the tie-in authors I'd read up until then. But "WW" just... stunk.


                            As for Season 8, it's been mostly Yay! for me. My biggest complaints are the delay between issues (which can't really be helped) and the inconsistency in the artwork. Overall, I prefer Georges Jeanty's work, even though he's been guilty of a little inconsistent work as well (disclaimer: I don't mean that the characters aren't *photo-realistic*; I don't expect that, anyway. What I mean is that characters' appearance isn't always consistent from issue to issue or even panel to panel.) It's not a big deal, just a little jarring sometimes. The writing - especially the dialogue - has been top-shelf so far; I can absolutely "hear" the actors' voices delivering their lines.

                            I just wish I had the patience to wait for the entire series to be released so I can go through the entire thing at once (of course, I will anyway, after it's all done...)
                            "Occasionally, I'm callous and strange..." - Willow Rosenberg, "Buffy the Vampire Slayer"

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                            • #15
                              I love it, its only impairment is that it is a comic book, which is great for the epic stuff, but obviously I'd prefer it if it was televised. But story-wise, one of the best seasons ever.
                              Interesting - the "obviously", I mean. Because, as a big fan of comics, I'm trying to work out if I would prefer it to be a tv show or not. I can't decide. On the one hand, I grew used to it on telly, so sometimes I miss things that were possible on telly but now aren't (actor's facial expressions, the rising music and the rising... music ). But then, there are things that a comic can do, and ways that it excites me, that tv doesn't.

                              On the whole, I guess I would prefer it to be on telly, because that was how I grew to love Buffy, but I'll definitely defend the transition to comics against anyone who thinks it's an out-and-out bad thing. It's just a change, that's all. One that I sometimes can't quite get my head around, but in many ways, fascinating.


                              -- Robofrakkinawesome BANNER BY FRANCY --

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                              • #16
                                Interesting - the "obviously", I mean. Because, as a big fan of comics, I'm trying to work out if I would prefer it to be a tv show or not. I can't decide. On the one hand, I grew used to it on telly, so sometimes I miss things that were possible on telly but now aren't (actor's facial expressions, the rising music and the rising... music ). But then, there are things that a comic can do, and ways that it excites me, that tv doesn't.
                                Oh lord, It's live action for me every time I'm afraid. For me at least It really is the 'superior' medium, and thats coming from someone who was brought up on Marvel comics.

                                I suppose It's really unfair to compare a TV show to it's comic spin off, because for a start the original product was live action, and had the benefit of the extra input of a brilliant cast, and a great set of staff writers as well as other assorted production people. All coming together to create one hell of a show, and because that made so much of an impact, you cannot help but keep offering up these comics as a comparrison, which often means the comics just don't cut it for me really.

                                Maybe thats why I've come to conclusion that in comic form we are obviously getting 'pure undiluted Joss' and so I've found myself realising that his view of what Buffy should be like is vastly different to mine.

                                For me Having a live actor 'emote' his lines on a screen just wins hands down over a static drawing, especially when I used to find it difficult sometimes to realise who I was looking at. Which did happen with me with some of the characters/panels.

                                For me TV has the ability to bring out a stranger emotional response then a comic, especially as the parent show was a live action thing.

                                Season 8 is a glorified spin-off and can't be compared to characters such as Spiderman or Supes who started life in the comic medium and who we'ren't known as anything else. Only later did they move into various forms of live action. For Buffy It was the other way around of course and it's very hard to forget the 'specter' of the 'real deal' hanging over it when reading them.

                                Thats not to say comics can't cover complex characterization and plots because they obviously can. Take 'Watchmen' for example, It's just that Joss doesn't seem to be aiming his product at that kind of audience (and why should he I suppose), so for me it ends up being rather more disappointing and I have to say a tad juvenile in places. I view them as 'Buffy lite'.

                                The upside? Well yes a version of Buffy is back, which is a good thing for those who are enjoying it, and it's nice to see folks discussing it on fan boards such as this one.
                                Last edited by sueworld; 04-07-08, 12:07 PM.

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                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by sueworld View Post
                                  Oh lord, It's live action for me every time I'm afraid. For me at least It really is the 'superior' medium, and thats coming from someone who was brought up on Marvel comics.
                                  Ah, well that explains it then. You should've been brought up on DC Vertigo instead

                                  Though, interestingly? I feel Joss tends much more towards the Marvel style than the DC ? much less mythic/symbolic, much more personal, about peoples' "issues", their quirks.

                                  Also, he totally stole various X-Men characters. Didn't he say either Willow or Buffy was kinda Kittie Pryde? And the less said about Gwen *coughRoguecough* on AtS the better! And Dark Willow?well, he even admits (via Andrew) that that's basically Dark Phoenix.

                                  But, re the TV > comics transition, it does put the comics at a disadvantage, cos it's not the way we got to know the characters, and it works in totally different ways. I can find a comic just as emotionally involving as a tv show (Y Last Man had me almost blubbing in public the other day), but if Y had been a TV show first?maybe not?

                                  The transition the other way round is often a problem too? mostly because movies adapted from comic books often end up shit, can't tell why! I'll be interested to see how Preacher (A Garth Ennis series) fares if it ever does get turned into an HBO show.

                                  But it's interesting what you say about undiluted Joss.

                                  Maybe thats why I've come to conclusion that in comic form we are obviously getting 'pure undiluted Joss' and so I've found myself realising that his view of what Buffy should be like is vastly different to mine.
                                  The issues he's written have not been my favourites, on the whole, and I think some of the other writers are doing a better job ? BKV (who did Y Last Man, actually!), Drew Goddard, for example. So, not so much the free rein of the comics that's the problem?but Joss himself having free rein. Kid, sweetshop, leads to vomiting. I think him and Russell T Davies seem to share a slight lack of restraint thing! Though it's hard to say what is an individual creator's input, even in a comic over a tv show?depends how the artist is involved, really, whether it's a dictatorial relationship (here's the script, go illustrate!) or whether there's more back and forth between them.

                                  For me Having a live actor 'emote' his lines on a screen just wins hands down over a static drawing, especially when I used to find it difficult sometimes to realise who I was looking at. Which did happen with me with some of the characters/panels.
                                  Yeah, that's been a big issue for me in the Angel comics?some of them look so similar! Had the same problem in Buffy with some of the potentials. Though, to be fair, I had that on the show too!

                                  Thats not to say comics can't cover complex characterization and plots because they obviously can. Take 'Watchmen' for example, It's just that Joss doesn't seem to be aiming his product at that kind of audience (and why should he I suppose), so for me it ends up being rather more disappointing and I have to say a tad juvenile in places. I view them as 'Buffy lite'.
                                  I wouldn't go that far, but I do agree that there are better comics out there. I'd say the Buffy comics, qua comics, are good verging on very good? but that's grading on a curve that includes Maus, Watchmen, comics by Gipi (newish Italian guy?genius genius genius), Halo Jones, Hellblazer (ok, that's a personal fave, not claiming it as great art or anything?but it gets me where I live. It's Ripper, if he wasn't such a southern pansy ).

                                  Buffy as a television show stands out because?.well, it's unique. Ooh, that's interesting. I've just thought about what Joss said re "Buffy is a comic book"? the show takes a lot of comic book tropes (geeky outsiders, superpowers, monsters, quippy banter, self-referentiality) and puts them on tv in ways that hadn't really been done before? but when you put that in a comics context, it's actually less unique. By taking from comics to make the tv show, when you transfer to comics, you don't stand out so much. It's a whole circular thing. Or maybe not circle. Wibbley wobbley influency wincey??

                                  So, Buffy doesn't make such a good comic because the tv show is so comic like? I'm not sure I agree with my own thesis, since I think the comics use the medium in interesting ways, so the typical comic book subject matter becomes more than just typical. The patchwork storytelling approach, if it all comes together in the end, could be very impressive.

                                  Also, it's very funny. Neigh!


                                  -- Robofrakkinawesome BANNER BY FRANCY --

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                                  • #18
                                    The way the show ended was horrible. Chosen was one of the worst episodes in entire show. S7 was disrespecfull to most of the characters, whom where forced to act OOC There's was barely a plot. The big bad was boring. And the solution to the problem came not from the scoobies but form W&H of all places. There's was no closure to a lot of characters. Issues between Buffy and the other scoobies (Giles in particular) were still undealt with. S8 was simply needed to wash away the horrible taste of S7.

                                    S8 has a lot of the same arcs as S6/S7 did. But it is fleshed out way better. The characters are showing their strength again. There's in interesting and cool big There's mystery and action going on. And we aren't ripped of some necessary Scooby-time because it is so hard to write. I would say that is as good as the earlier seasons used to be.

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                                    • #19
                                      but Joss himself having free rein. Kid, sweetshop, leads to vomiting. I think him and Russell T Davies seem to share a slight lack of restraint thing!
                                      Oh god yes! I agree 100% with that!

                                      Buffy as a television show stands out because?.well, it's unique. Ooh, that's interesting. I've just thought about what Joss said re "Buffy is a comic book"? the show takes a lot of comic book tropes (geeky outsiders, superpowers, monsters, quippy banter, self-referentiality) and puts them on tv in ways that hadn't really been done before? but when you put that in a comics context, it's actually less unique. By taking from comics to make the tv show, when you transfer to comics, you don't stand out so much. It's a whole circular thing. Or maybe not circle. Wibbley wobbley influency wincey??

                                      So, Buffy doesn't make such a good comic because the tv show is so comic like?
                                      Bingo! You've hit the nail right on the head here as far as I'm concerned!

                                      Yes, Buffy's comic book larger then life approach to story telling was very unique when it hit the TV screen way back when, but when you transfer that idea back onto a comic book medium, well then at best it just becomes rather 'average' compared to what else is out there.

                                      It's also has the problem of being stuck between two stools really. For some fans of the show it's written content is too juvenile, and some more into comic books it's not action packed enough and too 'wordy', and not filled with enough big busted gun toting babes.

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                                      • #20
                                        Anyone that didn't love the most recent issue is secretly a robot, and is therefore incapable of emotions.

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