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  • Fallen Angel

    We have a few threads here for single characters, so I thought I'd make one for my favorite character, which happens to be Angel.

    What are your favorite moments?
    Which are your favorites of his relationships (both romantic and friends)?
    What are your favorite lines from him?
    What is your favorite of his speeches?
    What do you believe was his most selfless action?
    Which is your favorite Liam/Angel(us) flashback?

    1) NileQT87
    2) Paradise
    3) vampmogs
    4) Enisy
    5) basakbangel
    6) Julian
    7) electroGwen
    8) Nina
    9) Signe
    10) carousel_girl8
    11) kana
    Last edited by NileQT87; 01-03-08, 01:09 AM.

    "If there is no great glorious end to all this, if nothing we do matters, then all that matters is what we do."
    "Nothing in the world is the way it ought to be. It's harsh and cruel. But that's why there's us. Champions."

  • #2
    Originally posted by NileQT87 View Post
    We have a few threads here for single characters, so I thought I'd make one for my favorite character, which happens to be Angel.

    What are your favorite moments?
    Which are your favorites of his relationships (both romantic and friends)?
    What are your favorite lines from him?
    What is your favorite of his speeches?
    What do you believe was his most selfless action?
    Which is your favorite Liam/Angel(us) flashback?

    1) NileQT87
    Hey, I love Angel, he's darling. Okay, so my favorite moments...hmmm. Well, I love his first line, "Is there a problem ma'am?" I mean come on. That was great. I love all his moments with Faith on Angel, Five By Five, Sanctuary, Salvage, Release, Orpheus. Those are the best episodes of Angel to me, though there are so many. Then the obvious, my favorite relationships are Faith and Cordelia. Romantic and friendship with both of those women. Lines? So many.

    "Did you just call me a tit?" OMG.

    I loved his speech from Passion.

    "Why don't you both bite me?"

    "You are so gonna lose."

    Those spring to mind, I'm sure there are more.

    Well his most selfless action was helping Faith. Come on, he's a prince who saw the good in her.

    Comment


    • #3
      Great thread!

      What Are Your Favourite Moments?

      Hmm it is a hard one for me. I think Angel shone when he sacrificed his own happiness for other people. I loved him breaking up with Buffy because he knew he couldn't give her the life it deserved but I also like how he came to the Prom because he knew how much it meant to her. I really like how he acted towards Fred at the beginning of s3, especially in 'Heartthrob' when he visits her in her room, he cares about her a great deal and it is really nice to see. I also got a kick out of how he jumps in and tackles Spike when he bites Cordy, and then lifts him up and slams him down on the ground. Not only was it very cool but it shows how much he cares for her and I thought it was great.

      Which are your favourite of his relationships?

      I like nearly all of his relationships for a number of different reasons.

      Bangel was my favourite of his romantic relationships because she changed him, she was his inspiration for the hero he became and he cared enough about her to break up with her because he knew she deserved more than the life he could give her.

      I loved the Angel/Cordy "friendship" I hated them in a romantic sense because I felt it was incredibly forced. I must admit after Bangel I think it is really hard to give Angel another relationship, Tim Minear stated this was the reason they brought in Darla because it was a relationship that had happened before Bangel and therefore could work on that level, rather than replacing it. But I really did love their friendship, it is Ats' scooby gang and I just adore it. I love Cordy's "You're Welcome" it was great because Angel owes her a lot and brought out the best in him when she was around, just look at 'You're Welcome' as proof of that.

      I liked Angel and Gunn for the tense moments. There were quite a few moments where they got in eachother's face and were extremely aggressive towards eachother because both are hot headed physical guys. However, I love how in the end Gunn is one of the people who doesn't seem to lack much trust in Angel after hearing his plan whereas people like Lorne were very vocal about still not completely trusting him. Interestingly Gunn starts off the most untrusting towards Angel and ends up trusting him a great deal.

      Wes and Angel for obvious reasons- for the good and the bad.

      Angel and Fred- just really sweet.

      What Are Your Favourite Lines From Him?

      # "Personally I kinda want to slay the dragon"
      # "They talk about me in the chatty rooms!?" LMAO
      # "Let me get this straight, you and Gunn are dating?"
      # "Heroes don't accept the way the world is"
      # "You are so gonna loose" / "Man I miss watching this"
      .... can't think of anymore right now but I know there are plenty!


      Favourite Speech:

      Easily when he asks Gunn, Lorne, Spike and Wes whether or not they want to go in on his plan to take down the circle. The one problem I always had with Angel and the Ats group in general was how they treat eachother sometimes when it came to leadership. This threatening attitude they had, this telling not asking kind of attitude. This time Angel asks the group if they want to do it, he listens to them and says he can't do it without them and asks them as a team what they want to do. Not only that but we have Angel talking about the point of his mission, which is something I like. He is never going to be able to wipe out all of Wolfram and Hart but he can show them that they don't own them, that they can stand up for their beliefs.

      Most Selfless Action:

      God they are a lot. I think giving up his humanity and being with Buffy was probably one of his best because he gave up everything he ever wanted so that he could protect the world. As mentioned I also really like him breaking up with Buffy because no vampire can give her the life she deserves and I like how he was willing to give up his own life for Darla in 'The Trial.'

      I loved pretty much all the Angelus flashbacks to be honest.. especially in 'Darla' and 'Destiny.'

      ~ Banner by Nina ~

      Comment


      • #4
        What are your favourite moments?

        In no particular order: His first appearance in BtvS ("You're pretty spry, though"). His last moments as a human in "I Will Remember You". His last scene with Faith in "Five by Five". His conversation with Holland in "Reprise", and the following sex scene with Darla. That's all that comes to mind at present.

        Which are your favourite of his relationships (both romantic and friends)?

        My absolute favourite is Angel/Darla. David and Julie had incredible chemistry; all their scenes together were sizzling hot (especially the sex scene in "Reprise"). They had history, humor, an emotional connection that rivaled Angel/Buffy... and they're "soul mates", heh.

        My second favourite Angel-centric ship is Angel/Faith. Eliza said David is one of her favourite people in the world, and it shows in their chemistry. "Five by Five" nearly brought me to tears.
        Last edited by Enisy; 23-09-07, 03:38 PM.

        (set made by Francy for me)

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Enisy View Post
          What are your favourite moments?

          In no particular order: His first appearance in BtvS ("You're pretty spry, though"). His last moments as a human in "I Will Remember You". His last scene with Faith in "Five by Five". His conversation with Holland in "Reprise", and the following sex scene with Darla. That's all that comes to mind at present.

          Which are your favourite of his relationships (both romantic and friends)?

          My absolute favourite is Angel/Darla. David and Julie had incredible chemistry; all their scenes together were sizzling hot (especially the sex scene in "Reprise"). They had history, humor, an emotional connection that rivaled Angel/Buffy... and they're "soul mates", heh.

          My second favourite Angel-centric ship is Angel/Faith. Eliza said David is one of her favourite people in the world, and it shows in their chemistry. "Five by Five" nearly brought me to tears.
          I enjoy both those relationships too. Especially the Angel/Faith relationship. That's my fav. When did Eliza say David was one of her favorite people? I'd pay money to see David and Eliza act again together. Have you seen this clip below of Eliza talking about her first onscreen kiss with David and how it went? It's soooooooooo funny.

          http://youtube.com/watch?v=V4YOVS3jEkM

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by NileQT87 View Post
            We have a few threads here for single characters, so I thought I'd make one for my favorite character, which happens to be Angel.

            What are your favorite moments?
            Which are your favorites of his relationships (both romantic and friends)?
            What are your favorite lines from him?
            What is your favorite of his speeches?
            What do you believe was his most selfless action?
            Which is your favorite Liam/Angel(us) flashback?

            1) NileQT87
            2) Paradise
            3) Vampmogs
            4) Enisy
            I was just thinking of starting a thread on Angel So thanks Nile, that's a great idea And please add me to list.

            My favourite moments: Becoming part 2 obviously. and IWRY.. god I can't forget them..there are lots but just can't remember right now.

            Which are your favorites of his relationships (both romantic and friends)?
            Buffy and Angel of course.. no more

            my fave lines:Well, there are lots of because he is a pretty deep person. In wellcome to the hellmouth, the part he says " didn't say I was yours" and in Enemies "second best" etc.

            my fave flashback: ANGEL! he is like an angel living in this flashback.. perfect.. he is one of my favourite character in all Jossverse.. he knows what to do and the most mature one living.
            sigpic
            -Set by DeadLoversDawn from Evthreads-

            Comment


            • #7
              To keep this thread alive I thought we could discuss Angel's controversial decisions over time and what people think about them.

              Angel has made some pretty controversial decisons in his time, but the strange thing is, is that I think I would have probably made them as well. What I like about Angel is that the show plays with the idea of him being this big grand hero but then makes him a goof ball or makes him make mistakes many of us would, he isn't above that and that is what I love about his character.

              As for example, locking the Wolfram and Hart lawyers in with Darla and Dru. I will actually openly admit that I think I would have done the same thing, out of my hate for those people and in my head feeling that they deserved it. I know it isn't exactly the right thing to do, but I'm human I make mistakes and I think this would have been one of them. On this level I can completely connect with Angel. Holland didn't give a crap about anyone, he didn't care about anyone he hurts and I kind of agree with Angel when he says Holland doesn't qualify as a human in my eyes anyway. He put himself into this situation and if why should he expect anyone to care about him or help him when he didn't care about anyone else? I honestly think I would have done the same thing as Angel, call me a monster but I think I would have.

              I also think I would have left the humans in the hotel after they turned on me and hung me. Angel says "take them all" and leaves after being so hurt because of their betrayal. He saw the ugliest side of humanity, and I don't think I would have been *above* leaving them all their to fend for themselves.

              So what do you guys think? Can you connect with the things Angel has done, both good and bad?

              ~ Banner by Nina ~

              Comment


              • #8
                i admit i'd have done the same thing. angel and wesley think alike in many ways (in fact, they were the two that the circle of the black thorn was worried about thwarting them). they make very morally gray decisions, but they see them as the best things to do at the time. or they do things out of love that seem quite ambiguous. same as wesley willing to ruin his place in the "family" to save angel from hurting the thing angel cared most about (connor) or the willingness to kill his own father (hypothetically) for someone he loved (fred), angel would resort to black magicks to try to get connor back or even risk getting swallowed in the belly of the beast. their thinking was very alike.

                angel joined w&h not because he was sucked in by offers they had made (like gunn was), but because he did it out of love for connor despite wanting anything but to become swallowed by the belly of the beast. he risked everything, including himself, to salvage anything he could with connor.

                i relate to angel more than any other character in the jossverse in so many ways. he's the outcast of outcasts. he's more alone than any other character, even when he surrounds himself with a temporary family--it's just that--always temporary.

                he seems like a very untouchable grand heroic character... but he's very human. more human than most humans, in fact. he made mistakes, but some of them were only mistakes from a certain point of view. as angel said, if he had a choice he'd do it again (about opening the fissure to quar'toth), even knowing the risks.

                i relate to him in that he is a very intelligent character as well. i relate to those types of characters (hence, another reason i adore angel and wes so much). and of course, he has a dorky goofy side (it's so refreshing to see us oldies balladeer lovers get some representation). i really relate how to he's kind of stuck in the past. that's one of the things i love about ats is that how it reflects that angel isn't a young hip character. he sometimes shows his age (ale and a tavern wench, "sure, if you're tom sawyer painting a fence", his cheap tipping, can't use his voice mail, etc...)--it's awesome. it's a perfect counterpoint to btvs where the main character "lives very much in the 'now'." lorne is a good portion of the feel of the show in terms of this counterpoint--bringing the show to represent angel. he's not part of our time, but he has to deal with a world that is.

                angel always keeps getting knocked down, but he always gets back up in his fight. he makes mistakes--would make the same ambiguous decision again if given a choice or he might do something differently, but he always takes responsibility for it.

                angel stands for all the best parts of humanity: freedom of choice, mercy, forgiveness (and even if he doesn't give it when its needed--he makes mistakes), helping the lost souls who go unnoticed... but it's deeper than the way buffy fights for humanity vs. monsters... angel and ats have a lot more moral ambiguity on both sides. there are those like holland manners or the w&h cleaners which he has no problem killing. but on the other hand, he's willing to make some very dark decisions when he really cares about something (connor) or when in the long run, something is the lesser of two evils. angel often does have to pick the lesser of two evils (for example, jasmine's marxist utopia or freedom of choice).

                when angel deals with a big bad... the bad isn't some monster who wants to take over the town, send the world to hell or go home. his monsters are people who he did wrong (holtz), humanity itself causing w&h's apocalypse, etc...

                angel has a love and hate relationship with the very thing he champions--humanity.

                "If there is no great glorious end to all this, if nothing we do matters, then all that matters is what we do."
                "Nothing in the world is the way it ought to be. It's harsh and cruel. But that's why there's us. Champions."

                Comment


                • #9
                  Just noticed this thread. Thought I'd join. Sign me up please.

                  One of the best things that I like about Angel is that he is reminiscent of the king-hero archetype. In many ways, I see him as a cross between King Arthur, Aeneas, and Jack Bauer. He was a guy who often found himself in complex moral dilemmas (i.e. Connor, Holtz, Wesley, Jasmine, etc?). He is used as a pawn by unknowable and powerful ?higher beings' (Powers that be and Wolfram and Hart). He is often made to choose between greater and lesser evils. His ability for personal sacrifice is awesome. He is someone who believes in what he does with iron conviction ? not for want but for being.

                  When Angel first got his soul. He was a clean slate in terms of moral compass. It was like he was transferred from one plane of existence into another, and everything he ever knew was put into question. More importantly, he was a "new man" who had to find new reasons and a new sense of purpose. We see him do this several times, saving the puppy. saving the people in the hotel. But always, that ends in failure.

                  Which happens to be one of Angel's greatest message: Keep trying amidst failure, and the show remained true to that message throughout the entire series even until Season 6.

                  Was he trying to be good before he met Buffy? Hell Yeah! (IMO)

                  Does that make him any of a less person because he failed each time? No. (IMO)

                  There was no one who could give him directions (until Whistler and Buffy), no power to tell him what he can become, who he could be. But he still tried and the journey of trying to define good and evil/morality and ethics/purpose and free will never end with him, I think.

                  There was never any concrete morality in the series to cling on. He just tried to be good person, or try to define what it meant to be good in the best way he knew how and acted on it.

                  Did this always have good results? Not to some people. But that should be up to your opinion and your own beliefs. To me, (especially NFA and Jasmine's world) a Pyrrhic victory is a hell lot better than a "clean" defeat.

                  Are successful outcomes more important than standing up for what you believe is right? Are you willing to risk peace, the status quo, everything you ?thought' to be true for your beliefs, ideals and convictions and vice versa?

                  Angel was (IMO), and that is where I think the moral "flexibility" that some people accuse him of.

                  Angel was left to his own devices (until Buffy and Whistler, but they only helped pushed him him towards the direction he always wanted to take) to define himself with his new found soul. Questioning what is good and what is evil is tough enough ? Questioning everything you ever knew to be true is a lot tougher.

                  This quest never ended. It kept happening since the start of the show until NFA.

                  A good essay in http://community.livejournal.com/ido...ion/13159.html, says that Angel is a hero king or sacrificial hero in the sense that there is no finality to his journey. It just goes on and on. It's Sysiphic in the real Albert Camus sense...



                  What are your favorite moments?
                  When Angel apologized to Holtz? That was sublime for me. Kinda summarized what Angel was about

                  Which are your favorites of his relationships (both romantic and friends)?

                  Bangel! And, Doyle.

                  What are your favorite lines from him?

                  I'm a funny guy. Hello dry wit

                  What is your favorite of his speeches?

                  His speech to Connor before kicking him out of the house.

                  What do you believe was his most selfless action?

                  Leaving Buffy/Connor. They symbolized the human part of him.
                  Last edited by Julian; 22-12-07, 08:52 AM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    welcome to the angel-love, julian!

                    i especially love what you have to say about the king-hero archetype in the vein of king arthur. he's totally that.

                    one of the things that i love about him is that he's the most old-fashioned character--the most old-world anti-hero. it is a stark contrast to the valley girl origins of the buffy character and a perfect counterbalance... just like the entire slayer mythology and how vampires/demons are treated. buffy is a modern concept stuck in the archaic... and angel is the archaic stuck in and having to deal with the modern world. vampires and demons are decidedly old world, but these have to live in the present. on the other hand, buffy has to balance the modern world with ancient tradition. angel is buffy's counterbalance. the idea of the two shows--exact opposites--compliment each other and create a much fuller and deeper universe.

                    angel is the most philosophical character. he's the king of the morality plays. he's his own worst enemy (literally and metaphorically). he's also one of the greatest looks at multiple personality disorder in literature/media. and he takes love to its source: sacrifice. he's a champion of humanity, yet he's ostracized from it, unable to fully be in it... but he believes in it. and he learned to believe in it for the first time, not even when he was human, because of buffy... which was the most important thing to come out of any of his relationships.

                    he tried to do good for people before he met buffy, but he didn't believe in humanity. that's why he kept failing. buffy, without her knowledge, really, inspired angel's purpose and in whom where he discovered his entire philosophy on what he was championing. it wasn't the slayer he loved... he loved the human part of her that kept trying, kept doing the right thing when it seemed she got nothing out of it, that sacrificed everything (including him) just to help people. that was the source of angel's entire journey.

                    "If there is no great glorious end to all this, if nothing we do matters, then all that matters is what we do."
                    "Nothing in the world is the way it ought to be. It's harsh and cruel. But that's why there's us. Champions."

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      What are your favorite moments?
                      First ep of Buffy in the alley. Ep Angel last scene. NKABOTFD when he is trying to stay between Owen and Buffy so he be in the shot. Evil Angel at any time in Buffy. Angel drugged and being evil Angel. Angel playing hockey with Gunn with the little hockey sticks he got for Connor. Puting his hand in the sun and saying that if Connor needed to go to the hospital on the sunniest day, he would get him there. Angel back for last Buff ep ever, scene where he's jealous. Angel in innocence walking into and around the factory for the first time with no humanity in him.
                      Which are your favorites of his relationships (both romantic and friends)?
                      Angel and Buffy (romantic) Angel and Cordy (friends) Angel and Doyle
                      What are your favorite lines from him?
                      Human, vampire. Women, man-pire.
                      What is your favorite of his speeches?
                      Amends speech.
                      What do you believe was his most selfless action?
                      Leaving Sunnydale
                      Which is your favorite Liam/Angel(us) flashback?
                      He just killed his father and Darla walks in and tells him that now he will never get the respect that he wanted from him.
                      http://img368.imageshack.us/img368/3504/fireban2hr6.png

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I want to be part of this club! I love Angel.

                        I love Angel for the little things in his personality:
                        The fact that he is pretty smart and speaks many languages.
                        That he loves culture and art, it makes him a little geeky.
                        His favourite song is Mandy.
                        That he hates singing and dancing, but he loves watching it.
                        That he can act like a little child, but if he has to he is the most adult one.
                        I love his black and dry humor.
                        That he tries to be cool.
                        That he is shy.

                        It makes him a great rounded character. He is the most real one in the verse for me. He has the most flaws and virtues. He is the most flesh-out. He is a mystery ... but he is also explained very well.

                        What are your favorite moments?
                        I'm with Julian, the moment that Angel apologized to Holtz. It showed his greatness, his good heart and that his brooding is real.

                        I also loved the scenes when he tries to be a good dad. They are maybe a little dull. But they make him real and human.

                        Which are your favorites of his relationships (both romantic and friends)?
                        I'm a Bangel, so Buffy & Angel is my favourite romantic relation.
                        But Darla is fantastic, she is maybe the woman he should be with.
                        I love his friendships with Cordelia and Wesley.
                        But the most beautiful relation is with Connor.

                        What are your favorite lines from him?
                        pff, he had some great lines.
                        I love this lines:
                        Angel: "Hey, how can you... I'm not a eunuch."
                        Cordy: "Angel, it's just a figure of speech."
                        Angel: "Find a better one!"


                        What is your favorite of his speeches?
                        From Deep Down:
                        Angel: "What you did to me - was unbelievable, Connor. - But then I got stuck in a hell dimension by my girlfriend one time for a hundred years, so three months under the ocean actually gave me perspective. Kind of a M. C. Esher perspective - but I did get time to think. About us, about the world. - Nothing in the world is the way it ought to be. - It's harsh, and cruel. - But that's why there's us. Champions. It doesn't matter where we come from, what we've done or suffered, or even if we make a difference. We live as though the world was what it should be, to show it what it can be. - You're not a part of that yet. - I hope you will be. I love you, Connor. Now get out of my house."

                        What do you believe was his most selfless action?
                        His freedom for a normal life for Connor in 'Home'.

                        Which is your favorite Liam/Angel(us) flashback?
                        The moment that Darla walks in after that Angel killed his family.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by vampmogs View Post
                          As for example, locking the Wolfram and Hart lawyers in with Darla and Dru. I will actually openly admit that I think I would have done the same thing, out of my hate for those people and in my head feeling that they deserved it. I know it isn't exactly the right thing to do, but I'm human I make mistakes and I think this would have been one of them. On this level I can completely connect with Angel. Holland didn't give a crap about anyone, he didn't care about anyone he hurts and I kind of agree with Angel when he says Holland doesn't qualify as a human in my eyes anyway. He put himself into this situation and if why should he expect anyone to care about him or help him when he didn't care about anyone else? I honestly think I would have done the same thing as Angel, call me a monster but I think I would have.

                          I also think I would have left the humans in the hotel after they turned on me and hung me. Angel says "take them all" and leaves after being so hurt because of their betrayal. He saw the ugliest side of humanity, and I don't think I would have been *above* leaving them all their to fend for themselves.

                          So what do you guys think? Can you connect with the things Angel has done, both good and bad?
                          OK, so I can understand why he did those things. However, I don't actually think I have it in me to be the direct cause for somebody else's death. Honestly, I don't think I could kill Usama Bin Laden given the chance. Yes, I believe in punishment - and I agree with that the W&H people were bad people who deserved to be punished. And I'm not crying over them - "so long suckers!" is all I have to say. Despite this, I could never had closed those doors - never walked away. So I can understand Angel, I can, but I'm not sure I can really relate to him always.

                          On the other hand, I'm not sure I could be as "good" as Angel is sometimes. I don't know if I'd have forgiven Faith like he did, or actually resisted W&H and all other temptations as long and well as he did. I am - after all - human. I know I'm contradicting myself here, first saying I loathe W&H and their ways then saying I wouldn't be able to resist them. However, I think it'd be easy to start interacting with W&H with the idea "I'll change them - make them do good" then turn evil. This brings me to what I, again, love about Angel (because isn't that what this thread is for?). I love that he always tries to keep true to his "beliefs", that the good is the best side to be on. That you should never give up fighting. Now, I'm an extremly stubborn person, I hate giving up. So that side of him I can realte to - and it is the side of him that I do love the most.

                          After this little ramble, I thought I'd try to answer the Q's...

                          What are your favorite moments?
                          Ok, this is silly but I love it when he's starring at Cordy and she asks "Has someone been putting vodka in your blood?" It's funny, and I love funny ^^

                          Which are your favorites of his relationships (both romantic and friends)?
                          I'm a major Angel/Cordy fan I find them much more "fitting" than Bangel... It's just, I love relationships that start out as something other than romantic. That way, I find that often (in TV-shows) the relationship has more depth. Cordy and Angel were friends first, they really knew each other - both good and bad. I also like Angel with Giles. The tension between them is so great -IMO. They understand why the other person don't really like them, but they are forced to interact and I think that there is a mutual understanding as well. Am I making any sence? Probably not...

                          What are your favorite lines from him?
                          "You can't see the big pictue! You can't see any picture!"
                          There are so many good lines!! Some has been said here before ("I'm a funny guy" is one of the best as well IMO).

                          What is your favorite of his speeches?
                          The passion speach. I know it's Angelus not "Angel", but come on - it's the best

                          What do you believe was his most selfless action?
                          Sacrificing himself for Darla in season 2 (in The Trial I think). I really love how he's set on making sure Darla get's a second chance.

                          Which is your favorite Liam/Angel(us) flashback?
                          Hard, very very hard. I love the flashbacks in Orpheus - when he saved a puppy!!! It's just so funny and just funny.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Yay Angel!!

                            What are your favorite moments? There are so many it's so tough! I love it when he's jealous of Groo, when he tries on that awful jacket in The Girl in Question, when he has to wear the pink helmet, when he vamps out to get Connor to sleep, when he puts Mandy on the jukebox in Orpheus etc. I love funny Angel the best as you can see


                            Which are your favorites of his relationships (both romantic and friends)? I wasn't overly keen on his relationship with Buffy because it was so intense, I loved him and Cordelia together as friends. My favourite relationship though is Angel's with Connor as a baby it is so sweet.

                            What are your favorite lines from him? I can't think of any right now but all the ones vampmogs said I love.

                            What do you believe was his most selfless action? Regaining his soul to help the world rather than be with Buffy.


                            Which is your favorite Liam/Angel(us) flashback? I said it before but when he's listening to Mandy on the jukebox in Orpheus.
                            sigpic

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              What are your favorite moments?
                              Epiphany. Angel choosing free will and human dignity despite the mixed consequences. He faces up the possibility of no higher authority and has the courage of his convictions. He fights for his humanity symbolically.

                              Which are your favorites of his relationships (both romantic and friends)?
                              Faith. I love the redemption story and the tale of inner darkness. Wesley: In all his darkness and actually is inspired by Angel, even in terms of his tragic (but beautiful) liason with Lilah. Angel helps Wesley to realise the qualitive element to helping people rather than the quantitive theorectical ethics taught to him by his father and the Council.

                              What are your favorite lines from him?


                              Cordy:"What is stalking now a days – the third most popular sport among men?”

                              Angel typing on the computer: “Fourth – after Luge.”
                              Funny

                              Angel: You never know until you're tested.
                              Presaging Doyle's noble death.

                              Angel:"Don't believe everything you're fortold"
                              There are more but too many to come up with.

                              What is your favorite of his speeches?
                              His humanist Epiphany speech.

                              What do you believe was his most selfless action?
                              Signing away his Shanshu

                              Which is your favorite Liam/Angel(us) flashback?
                              Ooooh, ummm...Probably the Prodigal because it's the most telling.
                              Last edited by kana; 20-02-08, 11:24 PM.

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                              • #16
                                Friends of mine have been discussing this recently and I just want to ask for people's opinions

                                As we know, Angel is a series that deals with morally gray areas and this got me to compare it with other dark anti heroes on TV that I really enjoy. Detective Vic Mackey (The Shield), Jack Bauer (24), Tony Soprano (The Sopranos).

                                Tony Soprano is a mobster, a murderer as well as several other things that I'd rather not talk about. However, when he had a near death experience later in the series, he begins to questions his life and he looks at his relationship from different perspectives.

                                This, to me, is so very reminiscent of Angel season 2 as well as Angel's journey from being Angelus. Also, like Angel tony is a father and has a wife that he has problems with (Angel and Darla commparison anyone?). But most poignant of all, is the moral questionning that makes me enjoy these two characters so greatly.

                                Detective Vic Mackey shadows Angel's and Wesley's get it done brand of morality in seasons 4 and 5. Mackey has done murder in the name of the law. So has Angel, but for the battle between Good and Evil and all that jazz and so has Wesley for the council (in BTVS) and for the greater good as he saw it (in Angel). With the difference that Vic Mackey rationalises his morality (though there are some people who claim that Angel rationalises his actions too. I think that's a load of crap by the way), Angel and Wesley mirror Mackey's methods in certain occassions.

                                Lastly, Jack Bauer. Jack Bauer has murdered, taken drugs, tortured, Killed and even threatened to kill an innocent girl just to do what needs to be done. I love Jack Bauer because he's willing to do the dirty work of the government and choose the lesser evils. In Angel's case, it's the powers that be (again, some people have argued that the powers are infallibly good and that the problem that resulted in Angel sending LA to Hell in After the Fall is a result of him misinterpreting the vision - again, disagree) who have proven to be largely indifferent to the big war - and rather content to get the grunts to do the dirty work.

                                Also like Angel, Bauer has an estranged child, an isolated life, a dark past and a ruthlessness that transcends a lot of moral barriers. Oh! and let's not forget the pyrrhic victories!

                                If we compare Angel to these three humans, he seems like well, an Angel. However, I'll be the first to step up and say that Angel belongs in their category. Whether that's a good or bad thing is open to your personality. However, that's the thing that I like about them - They're realistic (anti)heroes (of a certain type anyway), not the pseudo ones that have a large mouth and a badboy Fonzie personality.

                                (In Mackey, Bauer and Angel's case) If you go off to fight in a war, you will be tasked to do a lot of dirty things. Things that have no acceptable perfect scenario but only lesser evils and containment. And where there is no absolute morality, but for your interpretation of "good" and how much you are willing to sacrifice to reach those percieved ends.

                                So what do you think?
                                Last edited by Julian; 21-02-08, 12:44 PM.

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