Angel: After the Fall #issue 8

[Nina]

Soon we can read this issue, and here is a cover of this issue. It's a Gunn issue.

click

[lee]

Glad to see its a Gunn issue. I only bought my 1st comic two weeks ago, and all they had was Atf issues 4 and 7.
I have to say, im quite impressed. The Gunn storys my favorite.

Who turned him? and it turns out he's been training vampires to kill slayers? Why does he hate Angel? So much stuff i dont know yet.

[Nina]

Oh, I can't wait to find out who turned Gunn ... on the cover I see two hands with black nailpolish ... Spike? Is that you?
I like the cover, Messina's covers aren't my favourites ... but I love this one. The expression on his face is well done.

Lee, I hope that you will read all the issues if that's possible ... or you can read the transcripts of KoC to know the whole story. Issue 3 and 5 are my favourites right now.

[lee]

Ive heard a few different theories, like Gunn was already turning at the end of NFA.
But i would LOVE it if Spike sired Gunn.

By the way, Nina, whats 'transcripts of KoC'?
Can i read KoC now?

[Nina]

I don't know if Gunn was already a vamp ... sounds weird. Aren't you dead for a coulple of day before you stand up again?

KoC is KingofCretins, he writes transcripts of every issue (Buffy and Angel)
The link to the Angel transcripts; is here

[lee]

Ok, i had a quick look at the transcripts, dont wanna spoil the story too nuch by reading it all.

One thing i really dont get, why is Gunn annoyed that he's a vampire? Considering vampires aint human, why would it bother him? Since when has a vamp without a soul ever minded being a vamp! never, thats when.

I think it was Spike that turned him, maybe thought seeing as Gunn was dying he may as well turn him so they would have abetter chance of survival. But maybe it was Angel and thats why Gunns pissed off at him.

[Nina]

Gunn hates vampires, he was never really okay with Angel being one because he hates vampires so much.

You can compare it to Angel. When he was human, he 'hated' religion and his father, you saw this back in Angelus who mocks religion and the first thing he did as a vampire was killing his father. Liam's problems with his father and religion are twisted when he became a vampire, but the issues were still there.

Gunn has the same, only it's more difficult because he is what he hates. So he tries to deny what he is because the hate for vampires and evil stayed, only it's twisted now he is soulless.

[lee]

How funny would it be if Cordy appeared as a Vampire and it was her that bit Gunn.

Anyone know release date for issue 8?

[Nina]

Issue 8 is out on 11 June 2008, and issue 9 is also released in June (the 25th). Two Angel issues in one month.

[lee]

thanx. Cant wait.

[NileQT87]

i liken gunn not to angel/angelus, but to sam lawson. sam lawson was a vampire who hated being a vampire, but still did all the things an evil thing does. angelus loves being a power-obsessed evil bastard who preys on the weak and savors it.

gunn's hatred of vampires in life made a bizarre imprint on his vampire self. and it isn't gunn. it's the thing that killed gunn, walking and talking like him. using a twisted version of who gunn was. playing and believing that he is righteous, but at the same time, killing innocents. vamp-gunn is everything gunn would have hated. and vamp-gunn is exploiting who gunn was to be the ultimate hypocrite.

and i dear hope spike didn't sire gunn. that would be a huge step back for the character--in fact, it'd make him completely on the wrong side of the fight. spike isn't evil anymore and raised his hand of his own free will--angel even told him away from the others that they weren't all going to make it. spike was the most aware of that besides angel. and if he really is a good guy, he'd know that that is the last thing gunn would want.

gunn would have been happier dead and finished--not with a thing wearing his face waltzing around L.A. using hypocritical righteousness for evil... attacking and being angry at the very person gunn spent 5 years believing in the mission of. that's soulless vampire logic--to twist and corrupt something into its most hurtful possibility and using the human as a template--making a vicious mockery of the previous inhabitant.

and it seems like it takes approximately a day for a vampire to rise. which means that it wouldn't do gunn any good to get vamped in an attempt to save him so he can fight. he'd be out of the fight as a corpse until the next nightfall. it seems the rule is that the vampires rise anytime between nightfall and the early morning hours the next time night comes.

[lee]

I hope its Spike that sired, as i dont really think it has to be an evil act.
Although, given the situation, i wouldnt call it evil, but necessary.

[AllenGray]

I don't think it's likely that either Angel or Spike turned Gunn as we can tell from the first two issues of first night that neither was really in a position to, also I think it would just add more to the story if this was a casuality and not a rescue. Or Harmony did it. I really wouldn't mind if Harmony sired Gunn.

[ThePoet's<3]

Oh, I can't wait to find out who turned Gunn ... on the cover I see two hands with black nailpolish ... Spike? Is that you?
I like the cover, Messina's covers aren't my favourites ... but I love this one. The expression on his face is well done.

Lee, I hope that you will read all the issues if that's possible ... or you can read the transcripts of KoC to know the whole story. Issue 3 and 5 are my favourites right now.

I looks like it could be Nina!! (BTW who's gnarly claws are those in the upper right-hand? EEEEEWWWWW!


I don't know how to feel about Spike possibly turning Gunn. Part of me wants him to not ever go there - to turn away from evil at all costs - even if it had cost him the life of a good friend - Gunn.

But part of me knows - and is actually waiting for the other shoe to drop - this new soul of his has to be tested. And I think siring Gunn, and knowing that Gunn is responsible for evil would be a sure test of that new soul.

Of course Angel sired a man who was dying in order to save a submarine from being destroyed in "Why We Fight". And in the end he had to kill him. So, Spike may end up having to do the same thing - if he sired Gunn - it would be fittign for him to have to take responsibility for his rash mistake.

Issue 8 is out on 11 June 2008, and issue 9 is also released in June (the 25th). Two Angel issues in one month.

OH YEA!!!!

[NileQT87]

http://uk.comics.ign.com/articles/880/880266p1.html

here's a 5-page preview.

[Nina]

I couldn't read the words very well. But I loved Gunn's thoughts about the vampire. I miss Gunn, I want the real Gunn back.

And Gwen's little story sounds like fun as well.


And issue 9 is in the stores next week, isn't it? I heard that they brought it out a week early.

[ThePoet's<3]

Well - has anyone gotten around to reading this issue?? Saw lots of chat about Issue #9...

I'm a little undecided about who turned Gunn! In a way - I'm slightly disappointed it wasn't Spike! I keep thinking eventually he has to do something to put his new soul in question. So I thought siring Gunn would be a perfect slip. And although I'm happy he didn't do it - now I'm "waiting for the other shoe to drop"!

I wondered if the Vampire who sired Gunn was anyone important? He denied having anything to do with W&H. However, it seems he was "affiliated" with someone.

I have to admit my history of Gwen is a little sketchy... I remember that she had found some kind of "gadget" to fix her little problem. But after that...? So I was not too clear on the beginning of the "Gwen Story".

Anyone have any thoughts about the "Who turned Gunn" reveal? Anyone else feel a little disappointed it was a virtual "unknown"?

[Nina]

We talked about issue 8 in this thread:
click

It's kind of a mess here, there so much threads about the same issues.

[ThePoet's<3]

Thanks Nina! Yes - seems we could do a little better with our "Thread-keeping" couldn't we?!?