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Thread: BtVS #2 from BOOM

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by TriBel View Post
    Because many of the things she says are characterized by duplicity (in the sense of being double).
    "I just love helping students. Not to mention, it looks excellent on college applications". As Spike points out, depending on how you look at it, her behaviour can be construed as confident or arrogant.
    Running for Class President would seem to contradict her claim "I don't care what people think". She's twice connected to double-handedness, a visual metaphor for serving two purposes or deceitful, deceptive. She meets him on edgeland, which is in itself a "double". Even her hair is doubled. I think she's deliberately constructed to convey equivocation and ambiguity, I think you're meant to question her motives. In fact, the conversation with Spike hinges on it him saying one thing "Luring girls like you into the woods" and her understanding it as another. I don't think she's necessarily faking it - I do think she's connected to doubleness.
    What You See Is What You Get. Class President follows the same logic as helping people. On the face the only contradiction is the debate on whether selfless acts exist. From Willow's comment, that has been her persona for a long time.

    The Spike thing, including the balloons, just comes off as a Pennywise reference, right down to the glowing eyes.

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    The Spike thing, including the balloons, just comes off as a Pennywise reference, right down to the glowing eyes.
    So...what you see is not what you get? You don't get a vampire with a balloon. You get a vampire with a balloon to which certain meanings attached to Pennywise adhere? And, forgive me if I'm wrong because I haven't seen Pennywise for years, what you get with Pennywise is not what it is? The ambiguity adheres to both of them. You've used the word "persona" - a role, a mask, a facade.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TriBel View Post
    So...what you see is not what you get? You don't get a vampire with a balloon. You get a vampire with a balloon to which certain meanings attached to Pennywise adhere? And, forgive me if I'm wrong because I haven't seen Pennywise for years, what you get with Pennywise is not what it is? The ambiguity adheres to both of them. You've used the word "persona" - a role, a mask, a facade.
    No, I'm saying it's just a ripoff of IT. No other connotations applied.

    A persona is one we all display to the world. In this instance, it is apparently one she has had for ages from what Willow says. Therefore there is no show!Cordy hidden in there. She's not playing it up to get votes like the show. That's just who she is in this world.

    Basically, it's a reboot. They can claim is the Buffy we knew, but it's clear it is not. I see atoe laughing, yet why? This is not show!Buffy. She has yet to defy or even really push back against Giles and this Giles is far more aggressive than show!Giles, so no, it doesn't really make sense that he doesn't have words to say about her flaunting her superhumanness to all on the track.

    Much of the spec seems largely based on the idea that show characters are secretly hidden in there somewhere instead of new characters with the old names. There's no reason to think that. I mean, when have any of these deep meta theories ever panned out?

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    They can claim is the Buffy we knew, but it's clear it is not. I see atoe laughing, yet why? This is not show!Buffy. She has yet to defy or even really push back against Giles and this Giles is far more aggressive than show!Giles, so no, it doesn't really make sense that he doesn't have words to say about her flaunting her superhumanness to all on the track
    She literally defied and pushed back in the first issue. And really, I don't understand your general point. Obviously, this Buffy is not the classic Buffy (I'm so sorry, Buff) there are differences, of course, but it's still Buffy, it's still the same character. That's how reboots work, no?

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    Just read the issue.

    I have to be honest and say that I'm not really loving it. There's definitely things I like about it but if I compare it to the TV Series (which I naturally do) I find it lacking.

    My biggest disappointment is definitely with the portrayal of Buffy so far. Throughout the entire issue she's nothing but grouchy and snippy (with Giles, with Cordelia, with Eric and Joyce etc) and she was portrayed much in the same way throughout Issue #1 as well (bored and gloomy whilst at work, angry at Giles, she even briefly snaps at Willow for agreeing with Giles etc). We saw a glimmer of vulnerability when she was shy around Robin but other than that there's very little to love about her thus far. Her nightmare definitely suggests that she's struggling with her role as the Slayer and the pressures that are being placed upon her but that was true in the TV series as well and she was still written to be a multifaceted character who was also joyful, charismatic, funny, and witty etc. I also continue to feel that Buffy doesn't have much presence in the book as the protagonist. Xander's narration continues to usurp her role as the main star and since she hasn't had much to do in the way of Slaying she doesn't stand out as a hero from those around her.

    Her nightmare also felt very unearned. It was visually stunning but there's been so little done to establish her friendship with Xander and Willow that having them appear in Buffy's dream to haunt her over her failure to protect them just doesn't feel all that significant. They feel like strangers in the story so far. As I said in my thoughts on Issue #1, it's as if the writer's haven't bothered developing the relationships or the lore within this story because there's this assumption that the readership is already familiar with the TV series and will thus be emotionally connected to the characters/relationships already. But they're all so different to the OG characters (which was the point?) that I don't feel emotionally connected to them at all. For instance, I'm also supposed to feel sorry for Xander that Buffy and Willow bailed on him but it's really hard for me to think Buffy has done anything wrong by Xander when I feel like they're barely even friends? We see them watching TV together once and that's it. We weren't privy to them bonding whatsoever and none of the Core 3 even interact in Issue #2 other than briefly in their group text message.

    I also feel that it was a mistake to already have Willow in a relationship with Rose. In the TV series the Scoobies were very insular in Season 1 (Buffy, Xander, Willow and Giles + Cordy and Angel orbiting around them from a distance) and I think it helped establish their friendship and provided a solid foundation for future seasons. By having Willow already be in a relationship with Rose, she's already preoccupied with another character and it undeniably changes the group dynamic. It's actually a plot point within the story already with Willow cancelling her plans with Buffy and Xander because Rose was upset which left Xander feeling isolated and ignored. And from a writing standpoint, rather than use Issue #2 to further develop the Buffy/Willow or Buffy/Willow/Xander friendship they instead spend Willow's 'screen time' to introduce Rose and develop Willow/Rose instead. I'm not against the Scoobies having love interests early on but when they've done so little to justify the friendship between the Core Four it's hard for me to be invested in them like I assume I'm meant to be.

    My other main issue is the writing for Drusilla, Anya and to some degree Spike and Cordelia. Again, I appreciate that the idea of this AU is to change the characters and give them a new twist. After all, what would be the point of it if everyone were just the same? However, I can't help but feel that these versions of the characters are much flatter and duller in comparison to their OG counterparts. Drusilla in particular is very unmemorable thus far and is written as just your standard "Mwahaha" villain. She's far, far less interesting than the cooky Drusilla from the TV series who captivated audiences the moment she stepped on screen. Likewise, I did find it interesting to have Anya already running the Magic Box and be so morally ambiguous but we've also lost her brilliant humour and charm. Like Drusilla, the writing for her is very flat and unmemorable. I'm on the fence about Spike and Cordelia because I actually thought their scene was the best thing about the issue. I worry that this new version of Cordelia won't be as fun as snarky!Cordy and that this more confident and mysterious Spike won't have neither the humour or the edge and vulnerability that made fans love him, but this more friendly Cordelia was charismatic in her own right and I'm intrigued by Spike, so I'll keep an open mind.

    I will admit to being intrigued by Spike/Cordelia. They did have 'chemistry' in that scene (if such a thing is possible in a comic book) and I was surprised by how much I enjoyed it. But a part of me finds it very farfetched that Spike would be seriously interested in your average high school girl. It always made sense to me why Angel (and later Spike) would be interested in Buffy because she's The Slayer and is larger than life and Angel identified with her loneliness and how she straddled both worlds. But what would centuries old vampires be interested in, in your typical high school girl other than seeing them as a tasty meal? Who knows. The writing was good nonetheless and we really have no idea what this new Spike is like so they may convince me.

    I liked this new Cordy. A part of me was suspicious that she wasn't just pretending to be nice to win votes but when she was on her own she was so concerned about the balloon and the environment and there was no reason to 'act' as there was nobody else there (or so she thought) so I feel it's meant to be genuine. Besides, I feel it's unlikely that Cordy could pretend to be nice for at least 2 years straight when she had already competed against Willow and won the previous year. I think they obviously just wanted to go in the complete opposite direction with her for the AU. As I said above, I'm a bit concerned that in the long run this Cordelia won't be as iconic because she's missing Queen C's wonderfully snarky lines but she is actually quite endearing and charismatic throughout the issue.

    I do continue to love the art. The nightmare scene was great, as was the Spike/Cordy forest scene, and I *adored* the shot of Buffy with her feet up on the table in the library. I agree with whoever said that the library looks superb in this. The art is definitely the best thing about the new series and I think it's really doing wonders for this book. If the series had crappy or ugly art I would probably be less inclined to continue reading as I am pretty underwhelmed by the writing but the great art makes it more bearable.
    Last edited by vampmogs; 28-02-19 at 01:01 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by a thing of evil View Post
    She literally defied and pushed back in the first issue. And really, I don't understand your general point. Obviously, this Buffy is not the classic Buffy (I'm so sorry, Buff) there are differences, of course, but it's still Buffy, it's still the same character. That's how reboots work, no?
    No, she didn't. She stomped off then did exactly as instructed without intervention.

    No, it isn't the same character. That is how reboots work. That is the point. Saying "Cordy is faking her niceness" when there is no indication of that follows right along with it.

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    No, it isn't the same character.
    It's Buffy Summers. I don't understand - there are hundreds of takes on Batman but it's still Batman, right? Nobody claims that Burton's Batman and Nolan's Batman are different characters.

    Is Buffy from the movie a different character as well?

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    Of course, there may be difference between different permutations of a character, but it is important to retain a few of their most essential qualities.

    I think it is really clever what they've done with Cordelia. The old Cordelia ran the school with an iron fist. The new one has a more soft touch. However, she still manages to make Willow feel bad about herself, she walks all over people and is able to get her way. I look forward to learning more about her. It seems like she (and Spike) will play an important role next issue.

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    Quote Originally Posted by a thing of evil View Post
    It's Buffy Summers. I don't understand - there are hundreds of takes on Batman but it's still Batman, right? Nobody claims that Burton's Batman and Nolan's Batman are different characters.

    Is Buffy from the movie a different character as well?
    Who is trying to claim Burton's Batman and Nolan's Batman and Snyder's Batman are "the characters you knew"? No one. Different movies, different backgrounds and build-up for each series. Same with the Joker. There is no one claiming JN's Joker or HL's or JL's are pre-established.

    I do not care if they're not the same. The problem lies in 1.) People acting like they are and building meta around it and 2.) The writing attempting to use the precursor series as a shortcut for their writing in this one.

    The Scoobs were friends on the show, so they feel they can snap their fingers for this despite them just having met in issue 1. Unless Dru kept Anya tied up for a few weeks, this issue directly follows the previous. As mentioned, this drags things down and everything comes off as unearned.

    That good enough for you or are you going to continue with the Tucker Carlson thing where you scrunch up your nose and act confused no matter how clearly things are stated?

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    Quote Originally Posted by HardlyThere View Post
    Who is trying to claim Burton's Batman and Nolan's Batman and Snyder's Batman are "the characters you knew"? No one. Different movies, different backgrounds and build-up for each series. Same with the Joker. There is no one claiming JN's Joker or HL's or JL's are pre-established.

    I do not care if they're not the same. The problem lies in 1.) People acting like they are and building meta around it and 2.) The writing attempting to use the precursor series as a shortcut for their writing in this one.

    The Scoobs were friends on the show, so they feel they can snap their fingers for this despite them just having met in issue 1. Unless Dru kept Anya tied up for a few weeks, this issue directly follows the previous. As mentioned, this drags things down and everything comes off as unearned.

    That good enough for you or are you going to continue with the Tucker Carlson thing where you scrunch up your nose and act confused no matter how clearly things are stated?
    The benefit of using old character is that the audience knows them. You get to take some short cuts. However, you need to be able to play upon the audience's prior knowledge and expectations, which I assume can be tricky.

    Batman is a good example. One thing I hate about super hero movies is the obligatory origin story. We know that Batman saw his parents die, we know Peter Parker got bit by a spider and we know that Buffy, Xander and Willow are friends. Show me what is different! Get through the obligatory stuff quickly and focus on the new story. The issues are short, so each page is precious.

    And for each Batman or Buffy story, their status as cultural icons will grow. They don't only exist on the page and on the screen. They have a life of their own in the public consciousness and in every child who wears a Batman-costume for Halloween. The separate stories need to establish a certain boundary around themselves, but they are also all part of a larger story.

    I mean, if you read a folk tale about Jesus, would you go: "Who is this guy? What are his motivations? Son of God? Bah! That's convenient."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Willow from Buffy View Post
    The benefit of using old character is that the audience knows them. You get to take some short cuts.
    See I really disagree with that. These characters may look like Buffy, Xander and Willow and have their names but they’re fundamentally different in a lot of ways and it just has to change the group dynamic (which it has - see Willow prioritising Rose over Buffy and Xander right off the bat). So the writers do have to earn their friendship and can’t just rely on the audience buying into it because they loved the OG Scoobies. I mean, maybe I’m alone in this, but I’m a diehard Core Four fan and thus far this new series hasn’t sold me on their relationship at all. I was totally unimpressed by how little effort was put into building up their friendship in Issue #1. It felt like there was supposed to be some semi-significant time jump between Willow and Xander asking Buffy to hang out and then watching TV together and suddenly being “Scoobies” but based on the plot of the story there couldn’t be. And then Issue #2 doesn’t continue expanding on it at all (they don’t even share scenes together) but I’m expected to feel that Willow and Buffy have been poor friends to Xander for cancelling plans with him when it’s hard for me to understand why Xander would feel so letdown by Buffy especially who, as far as I can tell, he’s hung out with only one time.

    It’s the same thing with how the mythology of the Slayer was explained in Issue #1. Buffy gives a very underwhelming and abridged version of it whilst watching TV and then that’s it. If you’re a fan of the original series (which granted most of the readership probably is) then this probably suffices as we’re already familiar with the lore, but as a seperate story in its own right and it’s all very underwhelming and poorly explained. There was no gravitas to any of it at all and if I try and put myself into the new shoes of an entirely new reader I honestly can’t say for certain if I’d even understand what the Slayer is and/or what the basic premise of the series is about. I’d also be quite confused as to why exactly the comic is named after Buffy specifically because thus far she doesn’t feel the like the protagonist of the story whatsoever but rather just another character within the story. Other than being “the Slayer” there’s nothing that separates her or indicates that she’s important to the story. She doesn’t narrate it, she gets about equal screen time with the others, and in this issue at least, she doesn’t get a chance to act heroically. And I’m sure this will change as the series progresses but so far the villains are interested in everyone but her (including setting up a possible vampire ship with... Cordelia).

    I get what you’re saying but it does feel like they’re taking too many shortcuts IMO. If they want the story to stand in its own right then they’ve got to put the work in. Even comic book movies with their endless origin stories will usually re-tell who the characters are and build them up from scratch.
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    but it does feel like they’re taking too many shortcuts IMO. If they want the story to stand in its own right then they’ve got to put the work in. Even comic book movies with their endless origin stories will usually re-tell who the characters are and build them up from scratch.
    Oh lord this!

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    My understanding of how they were promoting this was as a reboot for a new generation of fans that would relate better if the characters/social references were updated. Hands up I haven't read it yet but have been looking at the previews and following the discussions because I'm intending to buy the trade. But my concerns without having seen it were just supported by what vampmogs who has read them has been saying, that without the knowledge and understanding of the characters the story's quality doesn't hold up.

    If they are wanting to change things, to explore aspects of the characters in different ways, breaking rules as they stated they wanted to, then the story needs to stand up on its own. I'm personally very happy with the idea that it is separate and distinct from canon, it means I really don't mind what they change and move around, I think it is interesting. But I shouldn't be bringing the depth from my existing knowledge if this is supposed to be running on its own merit. What I personally love the most about the original series is looking for the through lines for the characters. The quality of the show and the depth to which I adore the characters came from seeing them, adapting my interpretations and understanding as the story progressed with where the writers took them. Seeing how their pasts affected the present and then also then being able to consider how it would go on to contribute to their future directions and in considering the potentials onwards. Wishverse Buffy is different to original Buffy because of what she went through. There is character consistency, but she is different in a way that we understand. These characters are already being presented as starting from different points and with varying emphasis on specific character traits we can consider as 'true' to their original versions, and sidesteps to others from what I understand. That is what is interesting to me as an existing fan, what have they shaken up and moved around, but it doesn't create a standalone/strong story if that knowledge is necessary. They should be showing the reader character complexity and how and why the dynamics are forming. And that's not just for the new readers. But at the moment it doesn't sound like thought is going enough into what they are detailing without resting on a story it is supposed to be redesigning.
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    Quote Originally Posted by vampmogs View Post
    See I really disagree with that. These characters may look like Buffy, Xander and Willow and have their names but they’re fundamentally different in a lot of ways and it just has to change the group dynamic (which it has - see Willow prioritising Rose over Buffy and Xander right off the bat). So the writers do have to earn their friendship and can’t just rely on the audience buying into it because they loved the OG Scoobies. I mean, maybe I’m alone in this, but I’m a diehard Core Four fan and thus far this new series hasn’t sold me on their relationship at all. I was totally unimpressed by how little effort was put into building up their friendship in Issue #1. It felt like there was supposed to be some semi-significant time jump between Willow and Xander asking Buffy to hang out and then watching TV together and suddenly being “Scoobies” but based on the plot of the story there couldn’t be. And then Issue #2 doesn’t continue expanding on it at all (they don’t even share scenes together) but I’m expected to feel that Willow and Buffy have been poor friends to Xander for cancelling plans with him when it’s hard for me to understand why Xander would feel so letdown by Buffy especially who, as far as I can tell, he’s hung out with only one time.

    It’s the same thing with how the mythology of the Slayer was explained in Issue #1. Buffy gives a very underwhelming and abridged version of it whilst watching TV and then that’s it. If you’re a fan of the original series (which granted most of the readership probably is) then this probably suffices as we’re already familiar with the lore, but as a seperate story in its own right and it’s all very underwhelming and poorly explained. There was no gravitas to any of it at all and if I try and put myself into the new shoes of an entirely new reader I honestly can’t say for certain if I’d even understand what the Slayer is and/or what the basic premise of the series is about. I’d also be quite confused as to why exactly the comic is named after Buffy specifically because thus far she doesn’t feel the like the protagonist of the story whatsoever but rather just another character within the story. Other than being “the Slayer” there’s nothing that separates her or indicates that she’s important to the story. She doesn’t narrate it, she gets about equal screen time with the others, and in this issue at least, she doesn’t get a chance to act heroically. And I’m sure this will change as the series progresses but so far the villains are interested in everyone but her (including setting up a possible vampire ship with... Cordelia).

    I get what you’re saying but it does feel like they’re taking too many shortcuts IMO. If they want the story to stand in its own right then they’ve got to put the work in. Even comic book movies with their endless origin stories will usually re-tell who the characters are and build them up from scratch.
    I don't really get your point, and I don't think you got mine, because the bit you quote and address is hardly the essence of my argument.

    I think patience is important. Telling this story will take time, because each issue is fairly short and there is a long wait between each one. That being said, I think we have already gotten a lot of great characterisation already. After this issue, I feel I have a good sense of what they are going with for the Scoobies + Cordelia. This work is likely to continue, but it will likely be several issues before we feel truly familiar with these new Scoobies.

    Therefore, I think expediency is important. Issue # 1 got a lot of obligatory stuff out of the way. Buffy is the slayer, Buffy meets Willow and Xander, yaddi yaddah, etc. There's no reason to dwell on these things. One of the great things about "Welcome to the Hellmouth" is how fast it moves, and it was telling this story for the first time.

    And I don't think we really needed more time. They are high schoolers. High schoolers make friends quickly. We know that Xander has just the one friend—Willow—and Buffy has none. It makes sense that Xander would feel hurt that his best/only friend and the girl he extended an olive branch to yesterday would decide to effectively ghost him. It is very interesting to see Xander this way, because the original Xander could often—though certainly not always—take disappointment on the chin, sortaspeak. Compared to Willow, he often seemed kinda unflappable.

    One of my least favourite Buffyverse character is Gwen Raiden. We first see her in an origin story flashback. The flashback is cute, whimsical and funny, but the character we meet is flat, boring, painfully cliché and the show drops her before she is given a story of her own or any real relevance to the larger story. One of the great things about the Buffyverse is that it usually develops its characters slowly with time and care. Convoluted back stories is not a good place to start. It is better to introduce them quickly and then let them grow over time. Seeing that this is the second telling, we can cut some of the introduction down even more, especially where little is changed.

    You mention the mythology of the slayers. The mythology of the slayer is developed extremely slowly over the course of the show. We get a little drop of information each season. All you really need to know initially is: There's a girl, she fights vampires and she can do flips and stuff.

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    I was totally unimpressed by how little effort was put into building up their friendship in Issue #1. It felt like there was supposed to be some semi-significant time jump between Willow and Xander asking Buffy to hang out and then watching TV together and suddenly being “Scoobies” but based on the plot of the story there couldn’t be.
    I feel like you're being unfair. An issue has only 22 pages. The comic cannot put the same amount of effort into exposition as a movie, much less a TV show. Because of the nature of the medium the writers have to compress the crap out of the narration and focus on the key aspects.

    It’s the same thing with how the mythology of the Slayer was explained in Issue #1. Buffy gives a very underwhelming and abridged version of it whilst watching TV and then that’s it. If you’re a fan of the original series (which granted most of the readership probably is) then this probably suffices as we’re already familiar with the lore, but as a seperate story in its own right and it’s all very underwhelming and poorly explained. There was no gravitas to any of it at all and if I try and put myself into the new shoes of an entirely new reader I honestly can’t say for certain if I’d even understand what the Slayer is and/or what the basic premise of the series is about.
    If it was 1997 I'd probably agree with you but it's 2019 and teenage girl fighting monsters is basically its own genre. They don't have to explain anything, Buffy's a trope now. New readers will understand it because, while they might've not seen the show, they've certainly seen this premise explored elsewhere.

    @HardlyThere
    That good enough for you or are you going to continue with the Tucker Carlson thing where you scrunch up your nose and act confused no matter how clearly things are stated?
    Do you expect me to understand that? Please don't use obscure local pop-culture (Politics? I don't know...) references in what is clearly an international community. It's rude.

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  27. #36
    Slayer TriBel's Avatar
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    No, I'm saying it's just a ripoff of IT. No other connotations applied.
    I fail to see how you can have a ripoff without the connotations implying - particularly with an image. I think Pennywise was a good call - it's just the fact it has no bearing on meaning I'm querying.

    vampmogs

    These characters may look like Buffy, Xander and Willow and have their names but they’re fundamentally different in a lot of ways
    Sorry - I don't find them "fundamentally" different. The original characters were multi-facted - it feels to me as though they've gone through a 90 degree turn and we're seeing a hidden facet (sort of thing). What I find fundamentally different is, there's a lion and an alien in her bed and a picture of sunflowers on the wall.

    It was visually stunning but there's been so little done to establish her friendship with Xander and Willow that having them appear in Buffy's dream to haunt her over her failure to protect them just doesn't feel all that significant.
    Perhaps they're prophetic?

    I like it.

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  29. #37
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    REVIEW: In Buffy the Vampire Slayer #2, Everything Old Is New Again

    CBR Exclusives
    Feb 28, 2019

    The second issue of BOOM! Studios' Buffy the Vampire Slayer reboot by Jordie Bellaire and Dan Mora serves as a wider reintroduction to Sunnydale.


    https://www.cbr.com/buffy-the-vampire-slayer-2-review/

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  31. #38
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    The artwork is great, but I’ve got to agree with vampmogs that a little back story wouldn’t hurt.

    There’s definitely an element of “ you know these characters....we’ve changed them a bit - are you interested?” Singing to the choir, not bringing in new people.

    Maybe they don’t care about that yet?

    I did wonder at “ the prophecies” Drusilla mentioned.

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  33. #39
    Slayer Supporter vampmogs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TriBel View Post
    Sorry - I don't find them "fundamentally" different. The original characters were multi-facted - it feels to me as though they've gone through a 90 degree turn and we're seeing a hidden facet (sort of thing). What I find fundamentally different is, there's a lion and an alien in her bed and a picture of sunflowers on the wall.
    Well, mileage may vary of course but to me they're completely different people. Leaving aside the obvious differences (Drusilla is no longer insane and presumably never suffered through Angelus' torture etc) there's also the fact that they're not even from the same generation as the original characters. Given that the original Buffy's timeline now more closely resembles AU Joyces I think it's pretty significant that these new characters grew up and are existing in an entirely different time period. The shift in society in just 20 years is very noticeable and generational gaps are a real thing and since I think both where and when someone grows up is hugely significant in shaping them as a person, I do see these characters as being pretty fundamentally different.

    A lot of the changes to the characters are drastic. Thus far, Anya doesn't appear to have any difficulty conversing with people which was a trait she had in the OG series not only as a demon but pre-demon as a human too ("Selfless"). It's a significant part of who she was that is no longer there. Likewise, Drusilla is no longer insane which is really significant, and since Angelus' torture completely broke her as a human being how can we possibly say she's the same person in the AU? We can't even really argue that this is who she would have been if she hadn't been driven insane by Angelus because we don't know enough about pre-Angelus Drusilla to know that. But we know she's certainly nothing like the Drusilla we knew. And then there's of course Willow, who is not only confident and outgoing but at the age of 16 she is already fully aware that she's gay and is in a relationship with another girl. OG Willow wasn't even in the closet in Seasons 1-3, she was completely oblivious that she could be attracted to women, so how is she the same person? Obviously there's something very significantly different about her to have had her develop so differently than in the original series (possibly the fact she grew up in another generation which is evidence how different we'd all be depending on when we were born).

    The OG characters were multifaceted so, yes, you absolutely can pick apart any aspect of their personalities and point to similarities with the AU version of their character. There was times Cordy was nice, for instance. But I can be nice too. It doesn't mean that me and Cordy are the same person. So I don't see it as evidence that OG Cordy and AU Cordy are either.

    I do think you can sometimes look at AU versions of the characters to help understand who the characters are. For instance, Whedon clearly explored facets of Willow's personality previously unexplored in "Dopplegangland" with Vamp Willow. But the difference is that Willow and Vamp Willow were the exact same people until their timelines diverged due to Buffy not arriving in Sunnydale when she did. The "BOOM" series is a complete reboot of the series from beginning to end. It neither takes place in the same time period as the original show, characters like Robin Wood are an entirely different age all together, and these characters are completely different even before the series begun. It's a totally different world not just on the surface (as you say, Mr Gordo is now a lion and Buffy's house looks different etc) but by the people who inhabit it as well.

    And that's all fine. It totally should be different otherwise what's the point of even doing this? So I'm on board with that. I'm just saying that since it's so different and since the characters are so different that it's poor writing to take all these shortcuts and not lay down the groundwork adequately enough for why, for instance, these characters are all supposed to be friends. I know how and why OG Buffy and Willow became friends but what does AU Willow, who is confident and totally not socially awkward or lonely, see in Buffy? What does she see in Xander who she seemingly hasn't had an unrequited crush on for years? They haven't told us yet. Hopefully they will but so far I get the feeling we're meant to be satisfied with the very sparse development they've already had and carry on our affection for the original OG Scoobies over to this. Which I can't just do because they're not the same people who I fell in love with during the original series. Heck, in order for Alyson to win this role she'd have to play her audition entirely differently because the traits that won Whedon and Co over (as per their interviews) aren't even present in this new Willow.
    Last edited by vampmogs; 01-03-19 at 08:07 AM.
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    90s reference! Powerful stuff, Mom! ~ Buffy Summers

    Welcome to the Hellmouth Part Two is just as good as the first issue. Light on plot, it instead focuses on relationships and introduces new characters.
    The issue opens with a nightmare scene touching on the pressure of being the chosen one. The entire sequence looks incredible, elongated limbs and twisted faces of Buffy’s friends in school’s warped corridors harken back to Buffy’s horror-inspired origins. Later on, in the library, Buffy and Giles go into research mode and clash over the nature of their budding watcher slash slayer relationship. Meanwhile, Drusilla tries to persuade Anya to assist her. Since she can’t kill or harm the demon witch, she resorts to destroying her collection of artifacts and, in the process, unleashes a giant bat-thing, seemingly hell bent on destroying all vampires.

    On the personal side, we get to meet new characters - Eric, Joyce’s slightly awkward and a bit trying-too-hard boyfriend and Rose, Willow’s girlfriend. Rose is only featured in two pages yet she’s already a more compelling love interest than anybody Willow’s dated since Aluwyn. I like her striking look - half-shaven purple hair and studded sleeveless jacket, however, underneath all the punk edge, Rose seems really sweet and sensible. I love how she’s able to just hold Willow’s hands and help her handle her insecurities, because, yes, Willow is more confident and better dressed but that doesn’t make her suddenly complex-free. The issue introduces some well-known faces as well, starting with Miss Sunnydale 2017 and 2018 Cordelia Chase! Cordy is polite and incredibly nice to everybody but she’s still Cordelia, she practically radiates confidence, ambition and energy! What an awesome way to update a character! Cordy’s also a genuine environmentalist which is how she meets a certain blond vampire in the wood near Sunnydale High. Spike strikes me as much more serious and mature right off the bat and also much more sinister. Then there’s the teenage take on Robin Wood. He’s great! I was surprised by how much I liked Buffy’s and Robin’s first scene. Buffy’s a bit shy and reserved, Robin’s friendly, cute and very smooth - together they’re almost as adorable as Willow and Rose.

    This isn’t a Xander centered issue but he is still present all over it, peering at Buffy and Willow from the background. Xander clearly feels depressed and alienated, there’s also a rather ugly undercurrent of entitlement and deep insecurity running through his writing. Frankly, I am worried about Xander, I hope he doesn’t do anything stupid.

    Rest in peace Mr Gordo. This issue is simply excellent!

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