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  1. #101
    Scooby Gang flow's Avatar
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    I just finished the first volume of the Library Edition for season 10 and I have got only one question so far:

    When do Spike and Harmony have a one night stand (or an affair?) in London? Is it only mentioned in their conversation when harmony and Clem try to get hold of the vampyr book or do we actually see it in another comic or a flashback?

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  2. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by flow View Post
    I just finished the first volume of the Library Edition for season 10 and I have got only one question so far:

    When do Spike and Harmony have a one night stand (or an affair?) in London? Is it only mentioned in their conversation when harmony and Clem try to get hold of the vampyr book or do we actually see it in another comic or a flashback?

    flow
    Yes, that was actually Angel idea. So it was in his comics, but I don't remember what issue.

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  4. #103
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    It was issue 20 of Angel & Faith season 9, when Spike came over to join them in London. I did not like how Spike was portrayed in this issue. If you are interested in spoilers, you can find them here: http://buffy.wikia.com/wiki/Spike_and_Faith

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  6. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by flow View Post
    I just finished the first volume of the Library Edition for season 10 and I have got only one question so far:

    When do Spike and Harmony have a one night stand (or an affair?) in London? Is it only mentioned in their conversation when harmony and Clem try to get hold of the vampyr book or do we actually see it in another comic or a flashback?

    flow
    Angel & Faith S9 - Spike and Faith is the title.

    Spoiler:
    Spike is in London to help Angel, and is pining for Buffy, so Angel gives him Harmony's number (she's living in London too).

    You just need to get back on your feet. But you're over thinking everything. Tying yourself up in knots. Call that number. I promise you, thinking won't be a problem.
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  8. #105
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    I'm trying to find these on readcomicsonline and they're not there... Is there any other link where I can read this on online? (I'm talking about Angel and Faith S9/ Spike and Faith?) Thanks!
    I want the fire back. - Buffy Summers

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    Quote Originally Posted by SpuffyGlitz View Post
    I'm trying to find these on readcomicsonline and they're not there... Is there any other link where I can read this on online? (I'm talking about Angel and Faith S9/ Spike and Faith?) Thanks!
    It's there - there's A&F and A&F S10. The one they've called just A&F is S9. #1 is called Live Through This. A&F and Spike is issue 20 https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Ang...sue-20?id=3700
    Last edited by TriBel; 23-09-18 at 12:14 AM.

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    It's there - there's A&F and A&F S10. The one they've called just A&F is S9. #1 is called Live Through This. A&F and Spike is issue 20 https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Ang...sue-20?id=3700
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Dutchess View Post
    It was issue 20 of Angel & Faith season 9, when Spike came over to join them in London. I did not like how Spike was portrayed in this issue. If you are interested in spoilers, you can find them here: http://buffy.wikia.com/wiki/Spike_and_Faith
    The biggest problem I felt was the order, that it followed after his mini when he'd had a lot of time to work things out after he'd left. It felt too reactionary to come with some distance. I didn't think it was a great move for wanting to show him getting his mojo back as his opinion of Harmony is so poor, but if all he needed was to feel wanted/in control I can shrug and accept that he'd have used her for that (again), even souled if he was down enough. But that is also why it would have been better if it had come first imo. I think Gage had said something about being different around others and Spike/Angel regressing around each other which is often true. The conversation between Spike/Harmony in S10 when he apologises and says he was using her again and she's really disinterested as she saw it as using him herself I thought worked well as a follow up for both characters. It at least improved quite a bit of my issues with it.
    Last edited by Stoney; 23-09-18 at 06:21 AM.

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  14. #109
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    TriBel: [QUOTEIt's there - there's A&F and A&F S10. The one they've called just A&F is S9. #1 is called Live Through This. A&F and Spike is issue 20 https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Ang...sue-20?id=3700 ] [/QUOTE]

    Thanks for the link, TriBel! I have difficulties reading it, because Spike Looks like H-man

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  16. #110
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    I`ve read the Spike/faith/Harmony scenes. Thanks everyone for providing the links for free online reading.

    I really hated, how Spike looked in that comic. I also thought that he and Faith were talking to each other in an agressive way. I didn`t like that either. It was okay for me, that he tried to flirt with her and I was okay with her refusing him, but they both seemed to be angry about it all the time without any reason for that.

    The Harmony sex was plausible, imho. To be honest - if you belong to those who think Spike and Buffy did not have sex in the last basement scene in Chosen and if you take into consideration that Spike was still fully clothed, when Harmony started to bleed from her eyes and throw him off in Destiny, than the last time Spike has had sex was in Entropy with Anya. And that`s how long ago by now? Four years? Five years? I think it`s okay that he is having sex just for the fun of it and if Harmony is okay with that as well, it is fine. It actually shows, that Spike still has carnal desires and hasn`t turned into a stylite.

    I`ve started season ten volume two (Library Edition) and I think it is fantastic so far. The Comics are growing on me! Or maybe they are getting better each season. i did not like Buffy`s look though. She was dranw by Megan Levens and she looks emaciated.

    I am going to go out on a limb here. I have actually done speed dating in the past, before I met my husband (whom i did not meet on a Speed date). I so loved that Scene. it was fantastic and, folks, it is all true.

    The Vampire called Edmund, who hates himself made me laugh out loud, although I don`t quite undertsand, why Buffy did not stake him. Aren`t the new vampires not dangerous anymore?

    I also laughed out loud, when Spike said "I stay away from literature lovers. The reality never matches the fantasy. "But you don`t sparkle!" Excuse me. I`ll shove some pop rocks up me arse."

    And now the kittens! Mew!.

    flow

    - - - Updated - - -

    I am writing my thoughts as I am going along. Hope that doesn`t make it sound too confusing for you.

    I just noticed that Willow looked throughout Love Dares You exactly like Buffy, just with red hair. There was no likness to Willow Rosenberg at all. No I am starting to read Relationship Status: Complicated and Willow looks like Willow again. Yay! But sadly, Buffy has between she woke up in bed with Spike and the early afternoon hours not only grown out her hair a lot. She has also gotten a hairstyle that resembles that of my late grandmother. Ugh...what was Rebekka Isaacs thinking?

    Giles has just retconned the Vampire/demon/human mythology. It`s no longer "The demon takes over and the human is gone". Instead it is "A Vampire is a combination of the demon and the human personality - often itīs darkest aspects." So, that pretty much kills the theory about Angel/Angelus being two different entities, doesn`t it?

    flow
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  18. #111
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    Well it's another time where continuity is confirmed, but it is far from the only one (I mean showing all the flashbacks to their human selves and all the personality connections we understand there are to who they were is probably the biggest). I've never believed Angel/Angelus are two different entities, but there has always been inconsistency/ambiguity about how it is discussed and I think that's acceptable just because it is complicated how the original human influences the vampire they become and then what affect having a soul returned does, how that is responded to as well. There's always been a consistent character there though, just with different influences (or lack of). It only presented more literally in AtS S4 but that was contradicted before and after. I take the Orpheus split to be an internal representation of conflict anyway, it is only the literal split of memories idea that is more problematic and when that was raised recently I decided I'd look to really think that through when I next watch that season.

    But the notion that Giles presented at first of complete separation was fairly swiftly called into question and the reasons why the council would present it as such seem obvious. Angel even started to contradict Buffy saying vampires weren't connected to the person they had been back in S3. AtS did a great job of showing that the darkness is within Angel all the time too I think, as Wes says in S1 in Eternity, Angel walks a fine line. I think it was vampmogs who made the point that once a vampire Angel is a demon, there aren't literally separate parts residing within him. I'm pretty sure that was in this recent thread about Angel's inner workings which I found interesting.

    The most surprising notion about what they brought into the vampire mythology in S10 was that the demon essence that the Master, Darla, Dru, Angel and Spike share is all the same, from Archaeus. So this really emphasises that the differences in them come from their human personalities.

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  20. #112
    Library Researcher Double Dutchess's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flow View Post
    I`ve read the Spike/faith/Harmony scenes. Thanks everyone for providing the links for free online reading.

    I really hated, how Spike looked in that comic.
    So did I! Didn't you say somewhere that he looked like He-Man? That's a good description Fortunately Rebekah Isaacs did a much better job on him when she started drawing him as a regular character in S10.

    The Harmony sex was plausible, imho. To be honest - if you belong to those who think Spike and Buffy did not have sex in the last basement scene in Chosen and if you take into consideration that Spike was still fully clothed, when Harmony started to bleed from her eyes and throw him off in Destiny, than the last time Spike has had sex was in Entropy with Anya. And that`s how long ago by now? Four years? Five years? I think it`s okay that he is having sex just for the fun of it and if Harmony is okay with that as well, it is fine. It actually shows, that Spike still has carnal desires and hasn`t turned into a stylite.
    I didn't mind the sex per se -- there's no reason Spike should (un)live like a monk -- but I didn't like seeing him so desperate for sex that he basically propositioned any female in sight. I also think that if he was so desperate to get laid, he could have easily picked up a girl in a bar; he wouldn't have settled for Harmony anymore at this stage.

    Btw I do think that scene in Destiny was supposed to show him and Harmony having sex. It doesn't require full nudity! (Though I agree they could have done a better job at suggesting he was at least unzipped.) In any case, that we didn't see Spike having sex after the show ended doesn't necessarily mean he didn't have any. I'm not taking the IDW comics into account (where he most definitely did have sex) because my impression is that you haven't read them.

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  22. #113
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    JM was struggling with smoking/trying to stop during the show's run. He talked about it some at the cons I went to back then and in the con reports I read from others (which were around Buffy season 7 and Angel season 5), and he was often wearing a nicotine patch.

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  24. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Dutchess View Post
    I didn't mind the sex per se -- there's no reason Spike should (un)live like a monk -- but I didn't like seeing him so desperate for sex that he basically propositioned any female in sight. I also think that if he was so desperate to get laid, he could have easily picked up a girl in a bar; he wouldn't have settled for Harmony anymore at this stage.
    I agree totally. And especially as it was all supposed to be about him getting an ego boost, that hardly fitted him begging everyone and then ending up with Harmony who he has such a low opinion of. You'd have thought going out and picking up someone based on mutual attraction would definitely have been preferable to the desperate propositioning he went through before ending up with someone he thinks so little of, even if he believed her opinion of him was sky high. But they were obviously going for it being about being wanted and that he clearly still thought Harmony felt the sun shined out of his backside and was using that. When he apologised to her on seeing her next it did underlined that her believed adoration probably was supposed to have been part of it from his pov. At least he acknowledged that he'd fallen back to using her yet again, even if she did then totally dismiss the apology and made it clear she had gotten past mooning after him and had felt she had been using him. But regardless, it emphasised that the fact he wasn't in a great place had motivated it, rather than it being looked back on as just a positive moment. I still think if he'd had the crossover before his mini, so when he was still very much deep in maudlin before he was seen to work through a great deal of it, it would have made far more sense to behave like he did.

    Btw I do think that scene in Destiny was supposed to show him and Harmony having sex. It doesn't require full nudity! (Though I agree they could have done a better job at suggesting he was at least unzipped.) In any case, that we didn't see Spike having sex after the show ended doesn't necessarily mean he didn't have any. I'm not taking the IDW comics into account (where he most definitely did have sex) because my impression is that you haven't read them.
    Yes I think they were supposed to be having sex in Destiny too. That clothing was still all in place I think was to underline that it was really about using her, make it clear that it wasn't about wanting any true connection but just seeking to get to physical sensation and pleasure as easily as he could, all as a psychological response to being corporeal again.

    Well After the Fall is canon, so he had the relationship with Spider in the canon story before his return in S8. That aside, it's definitely plausible he had other casual relationships and didn't live in celibacy, but I also don't think there's any reason to believe it was a regular thing or that he necessarily did. Spike's tendency to be very flirtatious and suggestive in how he interacts with people seems to have gained him a reputation that doesn't meet what we actually see. He doesn't have a vast number of relationships more than the other main characters. I think it stems from the fact that we were shown that he absolutely wasn't opposed to having a physical relationship that didn't mean something to him emotionally. But then what we saw was that he tended to have a regular partner rather than being seen to have casual sex with numerous partners. So whilst it certainly doesn't have to have been, I could also believe that what we saw was it too.

  25. #115
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    Stoney
    Well After the Fall is canon, so he had the relationship with Spider in the canon story
    I just hope, Spider is a name and not the animal species

    flow
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  27. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by flow View Post
    I just hope, Spider is a name and not the animal species

    flow
    Sort of...

    Spoiler:


    But Spider was not a demon, she was a human who was "tampered with Wiccan magic" - and according to Spike, when they had sex her eight retractable spider-like arms used to pop up...
    Last edited by betta; Today at 12:45 AM.
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  29. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by flow View Post
    I just hope, Spider is a name and not the animal species
    As betta showed, kind of.

    It isn't a relationship that has a very pleasant beginning to be honest.
    Spoiler:
    It is a while since I read the Spike AtF, which is generally accepted as canon although Joss didn't plot these with Lynch I don't think, but they are written to lead into the ones that he did. As I remember Spike is being held captive when the sexual relationship with Spider starts and there is a tone to it that he's trying to keep favour to get help to escape, he even if I recall correctly at one point 'jokingly' offers to sleep with others if it will get him freed. There's certainly an unpleasant side within it but I'm not sure that the writing fully recognises it as such. That's as I recall anyway, it's quite a long time since I read it.

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