Results 1 to 12 of 12

Thread: Why "Early One Morning" ?

  1. #1
    Sunnydale High Student Cheese Slices's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Location
    France
    Posts
    90
    Thanks
    107
    Thanked 255 Times in 72 Posts

    Default Why "Early One Morning" ?

    I've always felt the choice of "early one morning" as Spike's trigger is quite interesting and leaves room to multi-level analysis. What is yours ?

    The lyrics :

    Early one morning, just as the sun was rising
    I heard a maid sing in the valley below
    "Oh don't deceive me, Oh never leave me,
    How could you use, a poor maiden so?"
    Remember the vows that you made to me truly
    Remember how tenderly you nestled close to me
    Gay is the garland, fresh are the roses
    I've culled from the garden to bind over thee.
    Here I now wander alone as I wonder
    Why did you leave me to sigh and complain
    I ask of the roses, why should I be forsaken,
    Why must I here in sorrow remain?
    Through yonder grove, by the spring that is running
    There you and I have so merrily played,
    Kissing and courting and gently sporting
    Oh, my innocent heart you've betrayed
    How could you slight so a pretty girl who loves you
    A pretty girl who loves you so dearly and warm?
    Though love's folly is surely but a fancy,
    Still it should prove to me sweeter than your scorn.
    Soon you will meet with another pretty maiden
    Some pretty maiden, you'll court her for a while,
    Thus ever ranging, turning and changing
    Always seeking for a girl that is new.
    Thus sang the maiden, her sorrows bewailing
    Thus sang the poor maid in the valley below
    "Oh don't deceive me, Oh never leave me,
    How could you use, a poor maiden so?"
    Last edited by Cheese Slices; 14-06-18 at 03:27 PM.
    What a challenge, honesty
    What a struggle to learn to speak
    Who would've thought that pretending was easier

  2. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Cheese Slices For This Useful Post:

    bespangled (14-06-18),DeepBlueJoy (15-06-18),Priceless (14-06-18),SpuffyGlitz (14-06-18),TriBel (14-06-18)

  3. #2
    Slayer Priceless's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Posts
    2,764
    Thanks
    5,422
    Thanked 5,103 Times in 2,462 Posts

    Default

    I've always thought this song was a working class song and when I heard it first being used as Spike's trigger I thought that Williams mother was too middle-class to sing such a song. No idea why I felt like this, as I know nothing about the song, and it does actually work well within the episodes its heard

  4. The Following User Says Thank You to Priceless For This Useful Post:

    TriBel (14-06-18)

  5. #3
    Sunnydale High Student Cheese Slices's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Location
    France
    Posts
    90
    Thanks
    107
    Thanked 255 Times in 72 Posts

    Default

    I'm not really knowledgeable when it comes to english folk songs, so I had no idea about it being a working class song. It's possible the writers didn't put too much thought into it (unlike me, haha), or thought that the historical accuracy wasn't a priority.
    We hear very little of it in the show, but the lyrics might be interpreted as both Spike's guilty conscience re. his past crimes and his assault of Buffy, and maybe as a reference to their relationship in S6.
    What a challenge, honesty
    What a struggle to learn to speak
    Who would've thought that pretending was easier

  6. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Cheese Slices For This Useful Post:

    DeepBlueJoy (15-06-18),Priceless (14-06-18),SpuffyGlitz (14-06-18),TriBel (14-06-18)

  7. #4
    Slayer Priceless's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Posts
    2,764
    Thanks
    5,422
    Thanked 5,103 Times in 2,462 Posts

    Default

    Oh no Cheese Slices, I am certain the writers put a lot of thought and meaning into which song would be Spike's trigger. It's vital to his character arc in Season 7 and I wonder if the song was chosen to represent the maid (Buffy/Anne) rather than Spike - because it's his trigger, just as Buffy and his mum were.

  8. The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to Priceless For This Useful Post:

    bespangled (14-06-18),betta (14-06-18),Cheese Slices (14-06-18),DeepBlueJoy (15-06-18),SpuffyGlitz (14-06-18),Stoney (14-06-18),TriBel (14-06-18)

  9. #5
    Scooby Gang TriBel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2017
    Location
    Manchester, UK.
    Posts
    969
    Thanks
    2,606
    Thanked 2,759 Times in 1,146 Posts

    Default

    It was one of the most popular folk ditties of the time. There's several variants of it. In fact, I think two different versions are used in the show.

    Here's some incomplete notes - I must have written them when I was feeling enthusiastic!

    "Brent Linsley claims Spike lies to the Scoobies, telling them his mother used to sing it to him as a child, when instead it is a song she sings to him as a grown man, before he becomes a vampire”. True, Spike does not relate the incident as revealed to the viewer but this does not preclude truth from his story. The song was in existence for almost 100 years before William was sired and was one of the most popular folk tunes in the country. It’s quite feasible the song has long and multiple associations with his mother. As seen by the viewer Spike reveals the song’s connection first with the loving mother, then with the castrating mother. The story he tells the Scoobies unwittingly locates his problems further back in his history – in short, in what lies beneath the current manifestation.

    I was familiar with Early One Morning prior to this exposure and, perhaps because the speaker never sees the maiden, presumed it to be a haunting. In my mind, it belonged in a typology of songs that includes “O Willow Waly” from Jack Clayton’s The Innocents (1961) (the relevance this has to BtVS has only just occurred). Associations aside, the song itself is unheimlich – and still about haunting. Sexual imagery is implicit in the idea of “the valley below”. In the scene when Spike stakes his vampiric mother, the sound comes from a music box and box is a common Freudian symbol for the womb. She closes the box and cuts the tune off. Sound, particularly the mother’s voice, can be heard intrauterine – the child hears the mother before he sees her face. We only hear the two stanzas but we can presume William has heard it in its entirety. There are multiple versions of the song but they tend to have motifs in common. The plea “Oh never leave me”; the roses “culled from the garden to bind over thee” speak of not only of love but also obsession and death (roses evoke Drusilla). The references to betrayal, the demand to know why she has been forsaken and left to remain in sorrow suggest hysteria with undertones of vengeance (conjuring the stories told to Anya). The fear or belief that her love “so dear and warm” was inadequate; and that her lover used her: all of the above describe aspects of William/Spike’s life (or unlife). In short, the song conflates unconscious wishes and fears relating to his three significant others: his mother, Drusilla and Buffy. There is a fourth presence – himself. While Angel is haunted predominantly by his past, Spike haunts himself (perhaps the reason he returns in Angel as a spiritual entity. This manifests itself I don't give a piss about atonement or destiny...." I've NO idea where this goes...just as I've no idea who Brent Linsley is!

    More notes...Dawn is the time most vampires fear but the time most desire to see. More so than Angel, Spike risks the sunlight. In Spike’s case, the sun appears connected to a death wish...Dawn appears only once - it's unique everyday. Twilight happens twice - sunrise/sunset....Valley is synonymous with Dale. Arrives at Sunnydale with a sick lover who is also his mother...Going back to Dawn - twilight is an effect of dawn. Drusilla's name means Dew but the ancient Greeks used it to refer to other liquids - including blood...

    I've no idea what I'm talking about!

  10. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to TriBel For This Useful Post:

    bespangled (14-06-18),betta (14-06-18),Priceless (14-06-18),SpuffyGlitz (14-06-18),Stoney (14-06-18)

  11. #6
    Slayer
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Posts
    1,051
    Thanks
    64
    Thanked 1,106 Times in 563 Posts

    Default

    It was a popular folk song and one she might sing to him.

    It was originally supposed to be I'll Be Seeing You from the 1930s and have something to do with Drusilla, mentioned in Lessons. It was changed somewhere along the line to Early One Morning and his mother, probably because they couldn't get Landau as much as the wanted.

  12. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to HardlyThere For This Useful Post:

    betta (14-06-18),SpuffyGlitz (14-06-18)

  13. #7
    Scooby Gang TriBel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2017
    Location
    Manchester, UK.
    Posts
    969
    Thanks
    2,606
    Thanked 2,759 Times in 1,146 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by HardlyThere View Post
    It was a popular folk song and one she might sing to him.

    It was originally supposed to be I'll Be Seeing You from the 1930s and have something to do with Drusilla, mentioned in Lessons. It was changed somewhere along the line to Early One Morning and his mother, probably because they couldn't get Landau as much as the wanted.
    Really - I hadn't heard that. IMO, Early One Morning fits better with the overall themes of "Mothers".

  14. The Following User Says Thank You to TriBel For This Useful Post:

    Priceless (15-06-18)

  15. #8
    Bronze Party-Goer Rebcake's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Location
    San Francisco, for now
    Posts
    193
    Thanks
    288
    Thanked 579 Times in 215 Posts

    Default

    There is an essay that looks at the trigger — among other things going on in Spike's head — that I found very thought-provoking:

    Triggers, Chips, & Souls - Trading Clothes & Ringing Pavlov's Bell - Meta on Spike by shadowkat
    Weird love is better than no love Buffy Summers

  16. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Rebcake For This Useful Post:

    Cheese Slices (15-06-18),Silver1 (15-06-18),TriBel (14-06-18)

  17. #9
    Slayer
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Posts
    1,051
    Thanks
    64
    Thanked 1,106 Times in 563 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TriBel View Post
    Really - I hadn't heard that. IMO, Early One Morning fits better with the overall themes of "Mothers".
    Mothers wasn't a running theme then. Wood being the son of a slayer was also an add-in. Wood was supposed to die early in S7. This all got reworked around the time of Sleeper/Never Leave Me.

  18. The Following User Says Thank You to HardlyThere For This Useful Post:

    Silver1 (15-06-18)

  19. #10
    Scooby Gang TriBel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2017
    Location
    Manchester, UK.
    Posts
    969
    Thanks
    2,606
    Thanked 2,759 Times in 1,146 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rebcake View Post
    There is an essay that looks at the trigger — among other things going on in Spike's head — that I found very thought-provoking:

    Triggers, Chips, & Souls - Trading Clothes & Ringing Pavlov's Bell - Meta on Spike by shadowkat
    Thanks for that - I've had a quick look at it - seems very promising. TBH, Freud and psychoanalysis is my default position so I'm comfortable with the soul/super-ego juxtaposition. Freud's not too great with the mother - for that I tend to turn to the French Feminists - Kristeva and Irigaray.


    Hardly There
    Mothers wasn't a running theme then. Wood being the son of a slayer was also an add-in. Wood was supposed to die early in S7. This all got reworked around the time of Sleeper/Never Leave Me.
    I'd disagree. I wasn't referring specifically to Wood. I think the relationship with the mother is of paramount importance to both Buffy and Spike. For the former, it tends to relate to the abjection of the mother (which comes to the fore in The Body). Spike's different - there's an unresolved Oedipus Complex (which is what we see with Anne) that's implicit - I think - in "Home, Sweet Home" and difficult to avoid when he turns up in Sunnydale with a sick mother who's also his lover. I don't think it's coincidence the first Slayer he kills says "tell my mother I'm sorry" or that a Madonna and Child icon features in at least two of the S7 episodes.

  20. The Following User Says Thank You to TriBel For This Useful Post:

    Priceless (15-06-18)

  21. #11
    Well Spiked Stoney's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Blighty
    Posts
    7,122
    Thanks
    8,460
    Thanked 10,290 Times in 4,231 Posts

    Default

    Where they consider taking things but don't is interesting, but where they did take it is the canon which informs the characters/show.

    The choice of song I'm sure was considered because of the historical appropriateness of it as well as the lyrics. The trigger was tied to the song itself because there were suppressed elements of the memory surrounding his mother's siring/dusting that Spike was avoiding thinking on I believe and so using something that linked in to that memory (through Anne playing the music box), kept the trigger 'hidden'. When considering that scene then and the memory it is linked in to, the lyrics seem to work to Anne's deliberate attack on Spike. Not just to twist it all up with the emotional connection to his mother who he has now corrupted, by spoiling something of his memory of her/his childhood/their relationship, but because of the links to deception, disappointment, abandonment and lovers in the song itself. As TriBel said, it can be read in relation to both Buffy and Dru as well as Anne. Particularly with the line 'never leave me' in it probably being very deliberately played on in the episode title and in the continued support Spike offers Buffy in the season, and their reliance on each other being a plot point.
    Last edited by Stoney; 14-06-18 at 10:17 PM.

  22. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Stoney For This Useful Post:

    SpuffyGlitz (14-06-18),TriBel (14-06-18)

  23. #12
    Slayer
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Posts
    1,051
    Thanks
    64
    Thanked 1,106 Times in 563 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TriBel View Post

    I'd disagree. I wasn't referring specifically to Wood. I think the relationship with the mother is of paramount importance to both Buffy and Spike. For the former, it tends to relate to the abjection of the mother (which comes to the fore in The Body). Spike's different - there's an unresolved Oedipus Complex (which is what we see with Anne) that's implicit - I think - in "Home, Sweet Home" and difficult to avoid when he turns up in Sunnydale with a sick mother who's also his lover. I don't think it's coincidence the first Slayer he kills says "tell my mother I'm sorry" or that a Madonna and Child icon features in at least two of the S7 episodes.
    Abjection of the mother is across the board on both shows. It's not inherent to any storyline or character. If there is a prevalent Joss trope outside ragtag outsiders save the world, it's the tragedy of the mother.

    What I was saying was at that point there was no Anne storyline so there wasn't anything for it to fit better with. It wasn't until this juncture in S7 that they created it, along with the mirroring storyline of Wood.

  24. The Following User Says Thank You to HardlyThere For This Useful Post:

    Silver1 (15-06-18)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •