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  1. #81
    Sassenach sherrilina's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by galathea View Post
    As far as I understand it, Dany doesn't really have many chapters in the 2nd book, so unless the producers bring parts of her plot from the third book forward, she won't get much story.
    Aaw, what a shame! Though given the way they add other stuff (like creating the character of Ros and inserting her everywhere), I'm sure they could think of something...I'm not sure how they will do books 4/5, considering that only half of the characters are in each one. Maybe they will simply integrate the two books and proceed chronologically with the plot there...

    We are certainly dealing with a multi-religion universe - the old gods of the north, the seven gods of the south, the drowned god of the iron islands etc - and it is stated that Melisandre comes from a foreign continent, so her religion is foreign to Westeros. I think it's not clear if Melisandre is actually imbued with the powers of her god or if she is simply a witch - like the witch that 'helped' Dany - or a supernatural being in her own right - like Dany for example, whose invulnerability to fire could also be seen as magic. I am not sure if the books take a definitive stance on this issue.
    Oh I missed the foreign continent thing...I guess on the map we only ever see the two continents? How big is Westeros supposed to be, anyway?
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    I have a question :

    Spoiler:
    But it wasn`t the first shadow. The first shadow kills Renly. Then the second shadow kills The Lord of the Stormy Ridge. Does it mean that every time , when Meliasandre sent the shadows , she has sex with Stanis , to create the new one ? Because in the book she even doesn`t sleep with him.
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    Bad Boy Lover Cori's Avatar
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    GoT is just love! Dany teaching Drogon how to breathe fire was just beyond adorable! And yay for moving the Dany and Jorah storyline along, I think Dany can no longer deny now that he is in love with her. Also, the introduction of the warlocks and the explanation re the House of the Undying were well done IMO.

    Poor Renly! I knew that Melisandre's shadow being would kill him but I'm still sad that he is dead and seeing Loras so grief-stricken was upsetting, I loved them as a couple. Also, poor Brienne, the only time she got to hold her beloved Renly was when he died. I do like that she serves Cat now and that they follow the book so closely when it comes to Brienne (at least so far).

    I still find it weird that Arya is a cupbearer for Tywin Lannister (and not Royce Bolton like in the book) but I enjoyed their scene together nevertheless. And at least they follow the Jacqen storyline closely. Arya's little smile there at the end was chilling.

    Jon's storyline is moving along a bit too slowly IMO. At least he got to meet Qoarin Halfhand in this episode and I'm guessing they will set out in the next episode to go after the wildlings so things should get more exciting in the Jon department very soon. Spoiler for book 2:
    Spoiler:
    I cannot wait for Jon to meet Ygritte and Mance Rayder and to see him live among the wildlings!

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    I really liked that episode!

    My love for Bran is so strong, too. He is so full of honour, it's portrayed so wonderfully. His father's son

    As for Arya, she's excellent, and that dark smile on her face was just amazing!

    I love Jon, so I am interested in his story, I just find myself so much more drawn to so many of the other stories.

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    Roadie galathea's Avatar
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    I think GoT has some pacing issues this season, but Ghost of Harrenhal is an excellent, excellent episode, with advancement for most storylines and some nice character work. Definitely one of my favourites so far.

    I am glad we got an update on Jon’s storyline. The story north of the wall is one of my favourites, and I wished we would see more of it. Sam rapidly becomes one of my favourite characters. He has such a good heart – which on this show can only mean that he will die a gruesome death one day. By the way, those shots on the top of the icy mountain are breathtaking!

    We also get a substantial update for Dany’s storyline, and I am quite pleased about that. I am really glad that she has Jorah at her side, because in her dealings with Xaro it really showed just how young and naïve she still is. It was the first time that I thought just how much she can be her brother’s sister – looking for an armada and gold and warriors to conquer her throne, when it only needs one ship and a handful of loyal men to set her over to Westeros. I liked that Jorah reminded her that she has to find allies in her homeland, if she truly wants to rule it. Now I have to wonder though if Xaro withdraws his protection – or worse, lashes out – when she refuses her offer. And I agree, Cori, the scene with the baby dragon was absolutely adorable!

    I really thought we would spend more time at Harrenhal, given the title of the episode – I am not actually sure what ‘ghost’ in the title refers to – so I was a tad disappointed that we didn’t get more scenes there, but what little we got was pretty damn awesome. The conversation between Arya and Tywin is one of the stand-out moments of the episode for me, and I am truly glad that the writers changed the set-up in Harrenhal from the books, because Arya working for her archenemies gives her whole story this season so much more weight and steps the tension up a notch. It also adds new layers to Tywin’s character, and it is interesting to see that, at the core, Tyrion, the son he despises most, is actually the child that is most like him, at least where intellect and foresight are concerned. Oh, I also like Arya’s ‘pact’ with Jaqen and I am curious to see whom she names as her next target. Tywin would be the obvious choice, but I doubt that is as easily accomplished as killing the Tickler.

    I also particularly enjoyed Bran’s scenes this episode. It is amazing to see how quickly he adapted to the responsibilities he has as the ruler of Winterfell. Compared to the child we saw at the beginning of the season, he has matured considerably, a fact only emphasised by Rickon’s childishly rude behaviour at the hearing. Bran’s dream about Winterfell being drowned by the sea (read: conquered by the Greyjoys) seems to indicate though that things don’t bode all that well for the Starks. I wonder if his dreams are truly prophetic in the sense that they herald inescapable events, or if they are more like a warning. I hope we learn more about that in the future.

    Anyway, great episode and I am really looking forward to the rest of the season!
    Last edited by galathea; 30-04-12 at 10:04 PM.

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    and her haircut. Nina's Avatar
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    I liked last week's episode better, but I enjoyed this one as well. My only problem was Renly's death, it happened so quickly and at the very beginning. I think I would've prefered a less sudden death more, especially because I didn't saw it coming. One blink and Renly is dead. Poor Loras though and Brienne! I love it that she is Cat's knight now but I felt so bad for her when Renly died.

    Usually I love Jon's story because I'm curious to find out more about the wildlings and the white walkers but I couldn't follow what happened, I've to re-watch those scenes and concentrate a bit better.

    Bran is awesome, but I love Rickon even more. No idea if he is screenfiller or a character who will become important in the future, but he gives me the creeps and his wolf has the coolest name. I like him popping up here and there.

    Arya's storyline remains one of my favorites, enjoyed every scene at Harrenhal. Dany's was interesting as well, of course she will be stuck between people wanting her on their side. She has probably the best chances to win the Iron Throne. Money and soldiers are not rare but royal blood (and thus a claim on the throne) and three dragons...

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    Roadie galathea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nina View Post
    I liked last week's episode better, but I enjoyed this one as well. My only problem was Renly's death, it happened so quickly and at the very beginning. I think I would've prefered a less sudden death more, especially because I didn't saw it coming.
    Yeah, I think even for a 10 episode season, the complex plot and the huge cast has become a bit unwieldy. There isn't much time to build up to particular points - like the first season, which basically felt like one long build-up to Ned's death. I sometimes miss that kind of slow built in the current season. This season also feels more 'scattered' than the last, which of course accurately reflects the scattered situation in Westeros, but I still find it difficult sometimes to have my emotions torn into so many different directions. Plus, I haven't read the 2nd book and, unlike in S1, I sometimes I feel that the show relies too much on the viewers to bring in the background knowledge from the books to make sense of the dynamic between characters. I actually wished they had split the 2nd book into two seasons, so they would have had the opportunity to cover more scenes from the books. Don't get me wrong, I still love S2, but I find it a bit harder to follow than S1.

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    Sassenach sherrilina's Avatar
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    I really enjoyed this episode, it's definitely one of my favorites of the season so far! I thought all the storylines were well done, with no random Ros!ObligGratutitousHBOBoobs! scenes thrown in. I loved seeing Dany's story (and omg her scene with Ser Jorah! So many feels..."Sometimes I look at you and still can't believe you're real." *ded*) progress more, I had been disappointed with her storyline thus far, and Arya's bits were priceless, so full of tension and excitement. If only Tywin knew who he really had in his grasp! I utterly love that kind of thing. Technically Littlefinger's statement that the Lannisters have both Stark girls is true now. And the Cat and Brienne bits were great as well (so was Brienne in love with Renly somehow, or something? IDGI), as were all the Tyrion parts (too funny, his reaction to the "demon monkey" thing and threats to Lancel). Even Jon's parts had some interest (and frankly I find his storyline to be the most boring always) in Sam's ominous statements of 3 horn blasts for a White Walker. Also Bran's scenes were great, especially his dream, in light of what we know of the Greyjoys' plans.

    Quote Originally Posted by galathea View Post
    I think GoT has some pacing issues this season, but Ghost of Harrenhal is an excellent, excellent episode, with advancement for most storylines and some nice character work. Definitely one of my favourites so far.
    IDK, I think the pacing so far is better than it was last season, which was so very, very slow, until the very end of the season--in comparison this season has been moving pretty quickly for the most part, major stuff happening, though some storylines have been progressing better than others (though same with last season). I do agree that this was an excellent episode, one of my favorites as well. I am enjoying this season much more than the last.

    I really thought we would spend more time at Harrenhal, given the title of the episode – I am not actually sure what ‘ghost’ in the title refers to – so I was a tad disappointed that we didn’t get more scenes there, but what little we got was pretty damn awesome.
    I think maybe it refers to the weird guy Arya saved, who is a bit like a ghost--creepy, moving about (killing people) silently, and unseen by others, hovering around. I thought that she would ask for Tywin first, but yeah, I wonder if he'll be next...

    Quote Originally Posted by Nina View Post
    Bran is awesome, but I love Rickon even more. No idea if he is screenfiller or a character who will become important in the future, but he gives me the creeps and his wolf has the coolest name. I like him popping up here and there.
    Lol why? IDK he just seems so random to me, the kid that most of the time you forget he exists because he's only appeared onscreen about 3 times and has only been mentioned about 5...and what was his wolf's name again?
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    and her haircut. Nina's Avatar
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    I don't know, I can't help myself but love him after that scene last year when Bran and Osha went into the tomb and that crazy kid was there with his crazy wolf Shaggy dog. The kid is so random... fantastic.

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    Bad Boy Lover Cori's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sherrilina View Post
    And the Cat and Brienne bits were great as well (so was Brienne in love with Renly somehow, or something? IDGI)
    Yes Brienne was in love with Renly, although it didn't come across very well on screen. Of course in the books you can have characters thinking stuff but not on the show. When Cat saw how distressed Brienne was over Renly's death in the book, she realised that Brienne was in love with Renly, just like Loras was. Maybe Loras felt this as well, which is why he acted sorta jealous in the previous episode. Renly even called him out on it.

    I think maybe it refers to the weird guy Arya saved, who is a bit like a ghost--creepy, moving about (killing people) silently, and unseen by others, hovering around. I thought that she would ask for Tywin first, but yeah, I wonder if he'll be next...
    Actually the episode title refers to the fact that Harrenhal is this huge haunted castle which everyone fears. This is my one complaint about this episode, that they never explained that. In the book, when Arya and Gendry learn that they were supposed to be brought to Harrenhal they freak out a little bit because so many horrible stories surround that castle.

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    Roadie galathea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sherrilina View Post
    IDK, I think the pacing so far is better than it was last season, which was so very, very slow, until the very end of the season--in comparison this season has been moving pretty quickly for the most part, major stuff happening, though some storylines have been progressing better than others (though same with last season.
    Well, I happen to like the slow pacing of the first season. With a show as complex as GoT I always find that a slow pacing and a careful introduction/exploration of the characters and a gradual world building is the right way to go if you want to make sure your viewers don't get lost. They may move quicker this season, but as a result I feel some of the depth is lost. I find myself checking up on story details/character backgrounds/location history way more often this season than the last, only to have a better grasp on what's happening, and I think that's not something I should need to do. The TV show should be able to stand on its own.

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    Sunnydale Girl _Buffy_'s Avatar
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    Sherrilina, yes, the Ghoust of Harrenhal is this misterious guy , I know it, but I can`t spell his name, who kills for Arya. He is not quite a human, IMO he is kina shapeshifter / OR MAY BE I WATCH TOO MUCH SUPERNATURAL, LoL/ , but unfortunately Arya won`t ask him to kill Tywin. Arya is just a kid after all and even then she realizes that she have to ask him for Tywin`s death , but it was too late. I just wander - if Arya would ask him to kill Tywin, would "The Ghoust" will be able to do it ?
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    Sassenach sherrilina's Avatar
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    Man, such an intense episode! Sh*t is truly getting real now...

    OMG the Theon scene in the rain! So traumatic, poor Bran and Rickon...and so was the scene of the Meister sending the raven ment to be a "earlier" thing to give a preview, before they jumped back in time to show the conquest?

    Also the Arya scenes were brilliant and so tense, omg...LOVED them, and also loved seeing these new insights into the Lannister patriarch, seeing a bit of a softer side to him. I'm glad they made this change from the book.

    Jon continues to be the most boring part for me, but maybe now his scenes will be more interesting--is Ygritte the same actress who was the maid who was learning how to type in "Downton Abbey"?

    Also, speaking of Ygritte, lol:

    Last edited by sherrilina; 07-05-12 at 06:38 AM.
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    and her haircut. Nina's Avatar
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    Jon not wearing a hat is so distracting, his poor ears! Ygritte is awesome, and yes the actress was in Downton Abbey before... that's where I recognized her from! But poor Jon, lost in the north. But Ghost wouldn't leave him right?

    Oh Theon, dumbass. How is it possible that two Starks can just leave with Hodor (HODOR!) and Osha. What was the point of Osha sleeping with Theon anyway? So she wouldn't be locked up somewhere? But I felt so bad for Bran (and Rickon) in those first scenes, poor boys. At least they are with Osha, she is smarter than most potential kings and seems to know some things about surviving. I think it's sweet she is so loyal to the little boys (at least it looks like that), after all she was just a wildling taken prisoner.

    The riots in King Landing were intense, poor Sansa. I hoped during the whole sequence that Joffrey would be torn apart by the crowd. That would've been such a fitting ending, and I wouldn't miss that monster one second.

    Arya's scene were once again my favorites, that in contrast to her older brother who is as naive as Jon and they also share this lack of character.

    Dany kind of annoys me; she is like a little child who wants an icecream. Instead of being grateful she and her people are taken care of, she acts like everybody wrongs her because they don't donate her ships and armies. It's sad they took her dragons though, but I doubt they will be gone for a long time.

    And how small is Westeros? Littefinger is every episode in another place.
    Last edited by Nina; 07-05-12 at 03:39 PM.

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    I absolutely love John Snow. Well, it annoys me a little the scene with Yogritte, because in the book he left her to escape, but here she scapes alone. ANyway. He is kind and noble. He and Arya are my favorites in first place and Dani too. I hope she wont become like her insane brother dreaming about the Throne like he did.

    Nina, the wolf never lives John./ At least untill 3 - rd book, which I`m reading now /.
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    Bad Boy Lover Cori's Avatar
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    Yay for a Jaime centric episode, that was long overdue! And yay for Jaime meeting Brienne! Their first interaction ("is that a woman?") was pretty perfect, I cannot wait to see more.

    Another very gripping episode, I enjoyed it a lot. The show really goes out of its way to show a softer side of Cersei, book!Cersei would never cry infront of Tyrion or talk about Joffrey this way. I also liked how both Cersei and Jaime were talking about each other in this ep, Jaime may not have much in the way of honour but he is right when he says that he has always remained faithful to Cersei, as wrong as that relationship is.

    I also loved that we finally got a "You know nothing, Jon Snow"! Really glad that Jon's storyline has finally become very interesting, especially with him now being surrounded by wildlings.

    Arya and Twyin's scenes continue to be great. I'm a bit confused though whether Tywin knows that she is Arya Stark or whether he just suspects that she is a noble girl.

    Theon, you are just a piece of shit!

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    Sunnydale Girl _Buffy_'s Avatar
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    Cori, didn`t this interaction between Arya and Twyin annoying ? I mean this has nothing to do with the book. In the book Arya never met face to face with Tywin and she barely speaks with Lord Bolton as his servent. IMO they want to show as that Lord Tywin is not so bad, but he is.
    Last edited by _Buffy_; 15-05-12 at 07:22 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by _Buffy_ View Post
    Cori, didn`t this interaction betweent Arya and Twyin annoying ? I mean this has nothing to do with the book. In the book Ara never met face to face with Tywin and she barely speaks with Lord Bolton as his servent. IMO they want to show as that Lord Tywin is not so bad, but he is.
    The interaction between Arya and Tywin is one of the highlights of the second season for me. It may not happen in the books, but it works very well for the TV show, because it gives Arya's story more gravity and adds interesting layers to Tywin's character. I don't think the writers show Tywin as a good guy; he is clearly ruthless, but he is not a one-dimensional villain and I enjoy that. I think for the TV show it is way more important to have steady characters than it is for the books. The sheer number of characters in this show is confusing as it is, so I think it is good to replace non-essential characters from the books with already established characters, especially if it works as well as it does with Tywin and Arya.

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    bewitching the mind Mara's Avatar
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    Realy liked the episode. Some thoughts. Theon is an a** end of thought. No but seriously I really think he is conflicted and is acting in this way more to proof himself then because he really wants to hurt the starks. Anyway he continues to be intriguing to me at least.

    Love Yiggritte, I love that she is calling Jon Snow out, the whole you are just a boy comment was brilliant and the fact that of course the wildlings turn out to be people just the same as the ones on the wall was to be expected but is still lovely. Looking forward to Jon Snow getting out of his very small believe and life experience box and learning some new things.

    Dany has started to annoy me. I can get around the childlike attitude but the fact that she doesnīt take responsibility for her actions and blames the people who are trying to help her does annoy me. I love whatīs his name who is so loyal to her, and I love the fact that he is clearly in love with her (yes I still forgot his name I know bad) but someone needs to get some sense into Dany.

    Arya and Tywin are love. Their senses are one of the highlights of an episode for me as well. I donīt read the books so I am of course not bothered by inconsistencies but I think their senses add a lot to both characters. I think Tiwyn just suspects that Arya is high born, she has done nothing notable for him to think that she is a Stark, or maybe I missed something.

    Highlight of the episode of course for me is Cersei, I love her scene with Tiryon as always. It feels a bit out of character for her to talk about Joffrey in this way especially considering how blinded she is by love for him and the fact that just a scene earlier she is telling Sansa that a mother canīt help but love her children. But maybe she is finally figuring out what will happen now that she canīt control him. Having said that I miss Joff on screen. And on that note I miss Mellisandre on screen (please donīt die)

    Loved to see Jamie back. He is right about his loyalty for Cercei. The relationship is weird and yucky but I am always surprised just how much they both seem to really care for the other specially Jamie. Hope he survives he is a good provider of much needed sarcasm. Oh and what the hell happened at the end are we supposed to believe
    Spoiler:
    the boys are dead?
    Last edited by Mara; 15-05-12 at 01:33 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mara View Post
    Oh and what the hell happened at the end are we supposed to believe
    Spoiler:
    the boys are dead?
    No, I don't think we are supposed to believe that those charred corpses have been Bran and Rickon. Those have most certainly been the kids of the family that lived on the farm. Of course, Theon wants the people of Winterfell to believe that the corspes are the Stark boys in order to make them compliant. That's why he sent Maester Luwin back to Winterfell before they had even found the kids, so he couldn't witness the deception. If Luwin believes the kids to be dead, everyone else will follow without question.

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