Spoilers section for Buffy Season 8 Comics

[ThePoet's<3]

Thought I would start a Spoiler Thread for Buffy Season 8 and into Season 9. Here we can talk without "spoiler fonting" any rumors or information coming down the pike.

So if you don't want to know - this is far as you should go!!!!! :cool:




I'll drop this one off to start with - a little info from Scott Allie about Season 8 and some info on Season 9 - OH! And just a weensy (and I do mean weensy :D ) bit of Angel/Spike info...:

http://new.ifmagazine.com/feature.asp?article=2393

Also a little about what's coming in issue 10 and 11 and 12-15!!!

Buffy: Season Eight #10 (Standalone written by Joss Whedon, pencils by Cliff Richards)

BLURB: Buffy and Willow meet a demon who reveals a dim future, forcing the two to reflect on their past. Meanwhile, back in Scotland, Dawn confides in Xander the deed that led to her mysterious growth spurt.

Information on Buffy: Season Eight #10- Scott Allie says... "That’s a housekeeping issue. That’s how things start with Joss. He goes “I have to fill a blank. There’s this thing I have to address, and it turns into something so much more. Issue #10, we did a contest on MySpace where you write in and say “this is how BUFFY affected my life,” and Joss picks the winner and the winner will be drawn into an issue of BUFFY. Joss read all the entries, and was really moved by a lot of them and the winner he was struck by and he basically wrote Issue #10 about her, sort of. It’s a Willow and Buffy issue, with some Xander. It’s an issue that catches you up and shows you how things are screwed up with our characters." He also said, in an audio interview, that the issue is comparable to episodes like "Hush" and "The Body." Oh yeah, and it'll make you cry fan tears.
Information of Buffy: Season Eight #11- We find out who/what the Big Bad of the season will be.

Information on DREW GODDARD's arc (ISSUES 12-15): Some vampires get a new power that isn't very vampire-y. The Scoobs head to Japan to dig up some info on the case.

Oh that last part is so intriguing!!! What kind of powers would not be Vampire - y???

Also it looks like issue 10 will be be very "Scoobie"-centered. That should please folks who love to see the Scoobs together and especially since we are coming off the Faith story-arc.

[vampmogs]

Good idea to start a thread like this :)

If this is a spoiler and speculation thread I guess that means we don't have to use spoiler tags? I had already read this interview but it is great you linked it cause now we can discuss it.

Dracula returning is interesting. People often state that this is the first time we've seen Buffy since 'Chosen' in canon but in fact it is not. In 'Tales of the Vampires' we see Buffy and two other slayers face Drac who has made Xander his manservant. Since this is actually canon this has to mean that Buffy has faced Drac sometime between 'Chosen' and 'The Long Way Home' and Xander did as well. So when Drac appears wouldn't this have to be mentioned? By both Xander, Buffy and Drac? If it isn't than it puts doubts into the whole, this is canon thing for 'Tales of the Vampires.'

Two stand alones in a row is interesting, I didn't think they were ever going to do that. Does this mean we'll have a gap month between both? Or will there only be a gap month between Issue #9 and Issue #10. I really hope we don't have a gap moth between Issue #10 and #11 as well because a month is a very long time to have no Buffy! I'm very interested in both issues. Issue #10 sounds amazing, a Buffy and Willow centric episode with some Xander in there as well! What more could a fanboy ask for! And Issue #11 reveals who the big bad is. Allie said we already kind of knowing, so I'm guessing he means 'Twilight'? But more will be clear and revealed in this issue? Perhaps we will discover who is leading Twilight and where it comes from?

Some have speculated that Roden was the flying boots guy from 8.01 and it make sense, seeing the pictures of Buffy from that mission are in Gigi's wardrobe in 8.07 However, it is also possible that the leader of Twilight is the flying boots guy and passed on these images to Roden to aid him in getting Gigi on their side? Just a thought, though Roden does look like the likely suspect. I'll just be a little disapointed if it was Roden floating over that castle, or if Roden is actually the leader of Twilight :(

The next arc after Faith's sounds interesting.. Japan with vampires who had obtained special powers. Hmm.. hopefully they do something worthwhile with this, sounds very fanficy to me but I have faith they can make it work. Though I'm dying to have an arc again back at the BHC because I love that setting and want to see more of our new slayers and Buffy/Willow/Xander interacting with eachother.

The Angel/Spike news is kind of cool. I really hope when they come it is for a good reason other than just shippy bantering and I'd probably prefer to see Angel and Spike come at seperate times than together to avoid that. I'm assuming that Spike's arrival will be to make Buffy aware he is alive, or to reveal she knew all along but for some reason hasn't went to see him. I'm not sure what Angel's will be, making to talk about him taking over Wolfram and Hart or what has happened to LA as a result of his plan? Or perhaps just shippiness.

[KingofCretins]

If Angel and Spike do come back mainly or even primarily to be 'shipped, I will probably give birth to a cat. It would pretty much completely undermine every Angel and Spike character development point from Season 5 of Angel, for one thing. For another, bigger thing, it would basically pin Buffy right back to where she was a few years ago for herself. That didn't seem to be the point of Season 8. If she doesn't end up with Xander, that's fine, a little unfair, but fine, but please, please don't let even more seasons of Buffy be defined by Buffy/Angel, Buffy/Spike, or a triangle formed.

"Tales of the Slayers" and "Tales of the Vampires" are in canon limbo. Their basic status is that they are presumptively canon, but are only canon unless contradicted. Which places them above the original Dark Horse series and Buffy novels, but below Seasons 1 through 8. I'd say they are about the same status as "Origins" is.

[vampmogs]

If Angel and Spike do come back mainly or even primarily to be 'shipped, I will probably give birth to a cat. It would pretty much completely undermine every Angel and Spike character development point from Season 5 of Angel, for one thing. For another, bigger thing, it would basically pin Buffy right back to where she was a few years ago for herself. That didn't seem to be the point of Season 8. If she doesn't end up with Xander, that's fine, a little unfair, but fine, but please, please don't let even more seasons of Buffy be defined by Buffy/Angel, Buffy/Spike, or a triangle formed.

Agreed. Besides why have a whole comic devoting to shipping when we have very few precious panels available? Obviously their feelings haven't just disapeared and it will play some part, but there are far more interesting things to do with the characters. As for example, the conflict between both sides about taking over Wolfram and Hart. I'd much rather have that dealt with than who Buffy loves more blah blah blah :heart: Personally, I'd hope that when Angel and Spike come back it is done to serve Buffy's story, I'm not even sure that would mean squabbling about Wolfram and Hart. I'd rather it have something to do with Twilight or Dana, something like that.

"Tales of the Slayers" and "Tales of the Vampires" are in canon limbo. Their basic status is that they are presumptively canon, but are only canon unless contradicted. Which places them above the original Dark Horse series and Buffy novels, but below Seasons 1 through 8. I'd say they are about the same status as "Origins" is.

But Joss has wrote some stories in both comics, so doesn't that kind of mean they must be canon? I'm really not sure. I know Whedon didn't write the Drac tale but that doesn't mean it isn't canon I suppose. I think all will be revealed, but you make a good point.

[Vampire in Rug]

I'm pretty sure I remember a quote from Scott Allie saying that he considers all Buffy comics written by Joss to be canon. Remember how Fray's scythe showed up in season 7? Aslo, all the slayers from Tales of the Slayers showed up in The Chain (the scene where "Decoy Buffy" is Chosen). I think that the Tales of the Vampires story with Dracula is deffinetly canon, and there'll be some reference to it in Season 8. Scot said that he wouldn't include Fray, TotS, or TotV in the Omnibus collections because he considered them to be more of a lead in to season 8 than anything to do with the old comics.

[vampmogs]

Yeah I was just scanning some boards and someone posted a quick little interview with Allie and they brought up the Drac story with Xander and Buffy and wether or not it will be brought up when Drac returns in s8. Allie said "you'll have to wait and see" with a smirk, so I'm not sure what that means exactly.

[ThePoet's<3]

He did that at D*C when we tried to pin him down about seeing Spike again. His face said "Yes" but his mouth said, "I can't really say anything about that". (Somebody get this man a deck of cards!)

you know there was also some speculation that the Flyiing Boots guy was Dracula!! Remember? So, maybe he's working with Twilight? He's worked with some rough characters in the past (Hitler in Spike vs Dracula) so I could see that happening

I do need to get TOTV!! I have Fray and TOTS. Fray is most excellent to me and I heard Joss is thinking about revisiting her story again. She was one of the best-drawn characters Joss has done. And yes - I can see how it would be a lead in to Season 8.

If all goes as the story is told - Slayer Inc. should "end" in the next few Seasons (However many Joss decides to do) of Buffy Comics. Because it all ends with one big battle and we don't know if the Slayer lives or not. We just know that no more Slayers are called again until Fray and her brother.

I think - if the story stays the same - it would be nice to see all the demons gone and Buffy actually living a "normal" life. Perhaps the timer on the cookies will go off and she will be "done".

KoC - MEOW!!!!! LOLOL!!! I don't think we will see shipping for a while. Maybe some playful banter between the 3 - Joss will toss a few 'Shipping bones to the 'Shippers. I do see him using them in a Slayer Inc./A-Team team-up against Twilight. But I just have this feeling he's going to turn the Vampires loose for a while to work on their own. Maybe he'll bring some 'Shippy stuff in towards the end of the whole Buffy Comic Series - kinda like in Season 7. But I can see him throwing a bone to all the 'Shippers who write Allie and ask him when they will see Spike or Angel.

[vampmogs]

He did that at D*C when we tried to pin him down about seeing Spike again. His face said "Yes" but his mouth said, "I can't really say anything about that". (Somebody get this man a deck of cards!)

It is all terribly vauge, it annoys me! :lol:

you know there was also some speculation that the Flyiing Boots guy was Dracula!! Remember? So, maybe he's working with Twilight? He's worked with some rough characters in the past (Hitler in Spike vs Dracula) so I could see that happening

I do need to get TOTV!! I have Fray and TOTS. Fray is most excellent to me and I heard Joss is thinking about revisiting her story again. She was one of the best-drawn characters Joss has done. And yes - I can see how it would be a lead in to Season 8.

If all goes as the story is told - Slayer Inc. should "end" in the next few Seasons (However many Joss decides to do) of Buffy Comics. Because it all ends with one big battle and we don't know if the Slayer lives or not. We just know that no more Slayers are called again until Fray and her brother.

I think this may be the grim future that Willow and Buffy see in Issue 10#.

I think - if the story stays the same - it would be nice to see all the demons gone and Buffy actually living a "normal" life. Perhaps the timer on the cookies will go off and she will be "done".

What is interesting about this is that that no slayer was called because all magics and demons left this dimension. I'm inclined to think that this happened because a part of a slayer is a demon essence, and therefore no longer were they created because that demon essence would have left as well. If this is the case does that mean Angel and Spike will be banished from this dimension as well, or will only the demon parts of them leave since they still have souls, perhaps making them both human?

[NileQT87]

if all the demons disappear... that will have to include angel and spike. thus, they are even relevant going into fray.

so there's a few options:
* all slayers lose their powers (essentially, that's killing the demon essence in the slayer line) and all demons are killed (incl. angel, spike, illyria, etc...).
* all slayers lose their powers and angel and/or spike get humanized.
* angel and spike become the only demons... in that case, what a way to bring fray into the super-official show canon rather than a distant side-story if she meets any of the characters who are immortals. fray would never run into the scoobies... but if this were the case, there are a few characters that could make it to her time period due to immortality.

[ThePoet's<3]

Good point about Angel and Spike! Hhhmmm... They would both need to be humanized!

I'm more interested in however what type of "non-vampire-y" powers the upcoming vampires might have?? What do you get from the term "non-vampire-y"?

Powers... Their powers would be - strength, healing (from injuries), immortallity, speed, what else?

What would be considered a power that's not of a vampire - that would be detrimental to Slayer Inc? Do you think this will be a negative power or a positive power?

I've often wanted there to be more than two en-souled vampires... Could there be?? That would sure put a kink in the works!!

[KingofCretins]

I'm still hoping that Joss isn't going to punt the storytelling in Season 8 and Season 9 as a de factor "prequel trilogy" to Fray. The events that lead to Fray don't actually *have* to happen in the current generation of characters.

[vampmogs]

Well really it could mean anything. They could breathe fire, fly, teleport, melt :roll: just think of Heroes and I'm sure we could think of many more! It could have endless possibilities and I'm guessing they are powers that are a threat to many people which is why the Scoobs go there to sort it out.

I get the feeling Buffy won't be going to Japan as well, not entirley sure about Willow. We know Xander is going and I think I heard Dawn is going somehow but I'm not sure where, but I doubt either would go alone without some slayer back up because it sounds like a pretty dangerous mission. Perhaps some of Buffy's Alpha team? Perhaps Renee? Now that'd be interesting.

[KingofCretins]

I've got to assume Satsu will be going; she is japanese, seems pretty odd that they wouldn't write her into it. Her name is actually a japanese term for cop, which I think is nifty.

[vampmogs]

I've got to assume Satsu will be going; she is japanese, seems pretty odd that they wouldn't write her into it. Her name is actually a japanese term for cop, which I think is nifty.

Ah very cool didn't know that. Well yeah I guess that makes sense, I just wasn't sure how far Buffy's Alpha team would stray from their leader. Though in 'The Chain' it appears Satsu was one of the slayers leaping down into the underground after decoyBuffy was killed so I guess they don't have to be too close to the real Buffy at all times.

[KingofCretins]

Yep, that is definitely Alpha Team leading the unfortunate back-up mission for the decoy.

I'd love to see more of the new character interacting outside their normal spheres -- Alpha Team without Buffy, Renee without Xander (they did a good job of that in 8.07), maybe have them interact on their own.

[vampmogs]

Yep, that is definitely Alpha Team leading the unfortunate back-up mission for the decoy.

I'd love to see more of the new character interacting outside their normal spheres -- Alpha Team without Buffy, Renee without Xander (they did a good job of that in 8.07), maybe have them interact on their own.

Yeah that would be nice, I especially loved the scene between Satsu, Rowena and Leah (plus some slayers in background) in Issue #4 talking about Buffy's decision to have Satsu as her fighting partner. More of that stuff would be great to see, which surprises me given I loathed pretty much ever scene with the potentials in s7.

Renee is a character who really interests me. I think it may have been you I was talking about this a while back, saying that perhaps Renee has no other real friends in the BHC which is why she has latched onto Xander? Something about her makes me think she is kind of like an outcast, a little like Willow, who just had trouble getting to know others.

[KingofCretins]

Mogs, not to pimp myself too shamelessly, but I actually dealt with bits of Renee's role in my most recent Season 8 fic, "Protective Orders". I think you'd like it, it has bearing on some of the long discussions on other thread, namely those about "Damage".

I don't assume Renee is an outcast in general, but I wonder if she might have isolated herself by 1) being more interested in the tactical/administrative part of their organization than in fighting and/or 2) being more interested in... Xander. There were hints that her crush is the subject of humor with people that know her, and presumably there aren't more than 50 or so Slayers at the BHC, plus Buffy, Xander, Willow, and Dawn.

[vampmogs]

Mogs, not to pimp myself too shamelessly, but I actually dealt with bits of Renee's role in my most recent Season 8 fic, "Protective Orders". I think you'd like it, it has bearing on some of the long discussions on other thread, namely those about "Damage".

I shall give it a read then, I love it when fanfics directly deal with things people have talked about in the forums, sounds very good. I've began a fanfic but not finished it, which has Renee as an outcast who the other potentials are mean to, but that was actually the last scene I wrote and haven't come back to it in weeks now.

I don't assume Renee is an outcast in general, but I wonder if she might have isolated herself by 1) being more interested in the tactical/administrative part of their organization than in fighting and/or 2) being more interested in... Xander. There were hints that her crush is the subject of humor with people that know her, and presumably there aren't more than 50 or so Slayers at the BHC, plus Buffy, Xander, Willow, and Dawn.

I felt that it was a subject of humor as well, which made me wonder if people mock her or are just having fun with her. Kind of that whole, are you laughing with me or at me kinda deal? I'm not sure why I get the vibe exactly, mainly because when she was all injured she was sitting alone whilst in the background everyone else was comforting eachother, only Xander went up to her from what we saw. And because we've never really seen her interact with any other slayer except the one who was joking around about her love for "Mr Harris" which could be seen as a laughing at her or a laughing with her situation.

[CanadianBtVSFan]

I was just thinking about Kennedy last night.

Since we know that Willow and Kennedy are taking their relationship slowly after the magical death incident...do we know if Kennedy is ever going to appear in season 8 for the comics? It would be nice to see her again.

[vampmogs]

I was just thinking about Kennedy last night.

Since we know that Willow and Kennedy are taking their relationship slowly after the magical death incident...do we know if Kennedy is ever going to appear in season 8 for the comics? It would be nice to see her again.

Whilst I disagree that it'd ever be nice to see Kennedy again :roll: I think she will def make an appearence in the comics. She is too important to Willow's story not to make an appearence and if Whedon is planning on bringing back characters like Riley, Spike and Angel who aren't currently tied to anyone of our characters anymore you bet he'll bring back Kennedy as well.

[Vampmaster]

After re watching S6 a thought just occurred to me... Do you think that Warren and Andrew will meet once again during this season? And if so what do you think a reunion between the two would be like?

[omri]

HOLLY CRAP!!!! OMG, that will be so amazing! Well, may revange to matter which side... it would be so intresting to see that..

[Vampmaster]

Yes I think that would indeed be an interesting encounter to view. Firstly I think that it would be a good test to truly see the side that Andrew is on or whether under the influence of his former boss he would find himself falling back to evil. I also think that if he were to resist and remain with the scoobies an encounter like this would be prefect with dealing with the development of the character of Andrew ever since Season 7.

In actual fact if I were a fanfic writer I would write such a thing myself. :D

[some spykie ship]

Yes I think that would indeed be an interesting encounter to view. Firstly I think that it would be a good test to truly see the side that Andrew is on or whether under the influence of his former boss he would find himself falling back to evil. I also think that if he were to resist and remain with the scoobies an encounter like this would be prefect with dealing with the development of the character of Andrew ever since Season 7.

In actual fact if I were a fanfic writer I would write such a thing myself. :D

I agree. I've been wondering myself when Warren will pop up again like he promised, and considering that Andrew once "followed" him, it's hard to say what will happen. However, The Scoobies have saved Andrew's life several times while Warren has left Andrew to rot, so I would expect Andrew to be loyal to the ones who showed him loyalty first. I don't think Andrew would have the nerve to go through with any revenge plans, though. Put the two of them in a room together, and give only Andrew a weapon, and Warren could probably talk his way out of the situation. Andrew is loyal, but not impenetrable.

[alexa]

Found this site concerning season 8 and Angel After the Fall.. minor spoilers

comic guide to BtVS (http://buffycomics.hellmouthcentral.com/html/main.htm)

[buffyholic]

Okay, I might be the only person that hasn´t read the comics. I haven´t bought anyone yet. Tell me, how is it? Good? Can you imagine it on DVD?

[KingofCretins]

It is exceptionally good so far, and you can definitely imagine it on DVD. If it's dialogue and character you have in mind, Joss wrote seven of the first eleven issues. Drew Goddard is writing the next four after that. It's actually a lot, well, *bigger* than the show in scale -- they could never afford to do this on television. There's already been one huge set piece battle, three or four complex one on one fights, a dozen or so complex sets. As of the next issue, the story will have spanned three continents.

I really recommend getting caught up. The first five issues are collected in a trade paperback, and the others can be purchased on back order from a comic store. If you just want to get caught up, there are transcripts for every issue on this site.

[Cinderela]

It is exceptionally good so far, and you can definitely imagine it on DVD. If it's dialogue and character you have in mind, Joss wrote seven of the first eleven issues. Drew Goddard is writing the next four after that. It's actually a lot, well, *bigger* than the show in scale -- they could never afford to do this on television. There's already been one huge set piece battle, three or four complex one on one fights, a dozen or so complex sets. As of the next issue, the story will have spanned three continents.

I really recommend getting caught up. The first five issues are collected in a trade paperback, and the others can be purchased on back order from a comic store. If you just want to get caught up, there are transcripts for every issue on this site.

And I strongly second that recommendation! And KoC's transcripts are so detailed that you can just *see* what's being described. S8 is *epic* and definitely worth the time!

[Sosa lola]

The latest issue of Wizard magazine has an interview with Joss.


WIZARD: ... it was mentioned... that this run could go as long as 40 or 50 issues. What's the status?

JOSS: The status is that we've got it planned to exactly 40. We know almost every bit of who's doing what and the main points of what we need to hit, where it's going, what it means, what the big climax is, who the villain is, and mostly who the writers are for each bit.

WIZARD: Will it end there?

JOSS: No, no, no. The last two arcs will be plotted out by me and Brad Meltzer. And he's going to write the first one, I'm gonna write the second one. #40 will be the final issue of "Season 8" and that will be absolutely the end of it until the beginning of "Season 9."


I'm really happy about the whole thing. Sounds like Joss knows what he's doing. And 40 issues? How many years 'til we reach that?

[Weredog]

Sweet! Praise Whedon!
Thanks for the interview, Sosa lola. It's awesome to know how confident Joss is into this. It looks like season 8 will end July 2010 -- without a break! :s Oh, well, I'll take what they'll give me.

And I'm really curious to know what Joss has planned for for season 9. I mean, will he pull another "end of all Slayers" season like season 7 and 8? Or will it follow along the lines of seasons 2 and 6 with mild, realistic arcs? And would that mean season 9 will be the last one?

So many questions, so little answers. :p

[bishopcruz]

Ok, this is kinda continuing from the 8.15 thread, but didn't really fit in there. I spoke a bit with Georges Jeanty today at SuperCon in Ft. Lauderdale, and was able to get one tiny bit of information out of him:

Xander still has a bit of romance coming to him this season. Though after romance, he kinda backed up and said it was a bit more like a hook-up. I asked who it was, he told me he couldn't say who it was.

"Is it an old or new character?" was my question in response.

"They are a known character." He said. "Who do you think it might be?"

A B/Xer forever I immediately replied "Buffy".

"I can't say anything else."

Now in no way do I mean to imply that he was hinting that it WAS Buffy, I couldn't read his response well enough to tell if he was smiling that I guessed right, or was amused that I was so off base. Time will tell I suppose. Though really at this point the options are Buffy and Dracula, and yeah, the latter would be wierd.

[KingofCretins]

Well, a hook up is more than nothing. That would be fantastic to finally get some canon Buffy/Xander.

From one of the panels you posted in another thread, I think Buffy/Xander as commiseration sex or something would be plausible. It *looks* like she's sort of watching him fondly as he walks around all forlorn in the distance or something.

[bishopcruz]

In order to keep my sanity though I will continue to assume it is Dracula until whatever happens happens. Joss and Co, have jerked me around before. Especially when it concerns this.

Other option is who? Dawn?

[KingofCretins]

I'm going to be grotesquely offended if it is Dracula. Sexuality retcon aside, it's rape by definition -- there can be no consent between two people where one has been brainwashed by the other. It would be absolutely the worst mistreatment of the Xander character ever conceived of in canon *or* fanfic.

As for other suspects... same old list, Dawn, Faith, even Willow.

[Thomas]

There's, um, Andrew... :roll:

I seriously hope it's Buffy. Anyone else, would be two strange for me. I hope it's not Dawn; I could never seeing Xander doing that to Buffy. Hopefully, the death of Renee leads to Dark!Xander, which leads to Buffy, going, "He's all dark and sexy!", which leads to sex, then to, "OMG, I cannot believe we did that!" That could lead to more between the two, or nothing at all, but the window would definitely be wide open for it.

[Wolfie Gilmore]

I'm going to be grotesquely offended if it is Dracula. Sexuality retcon aside, it's rape by definition -- there can be no consent between two people where one has been brainwashed by the other. It would be absolutely the worst mistreatment of the Xander character ever conceived of in canon *or* fanfic.

As for other suspects... same old list, Dawn, Faith, even Willow.

Just had a very sad and twisted thought about a Willow/Xander hookup. If they had grief!sex after the funeral, at which they'd be smartly dressed... you could get a very bitter comment from one of them about it being a formalwear fluke. Ouch.

[vampmogs]

I'm going to be grotesquely offended if it is Dracula. Sexuality retcon aside, it's rape by definition -- there can be no consent between two people where one has been brainwashed by the other. It would be absolutely the worst mistreatment of the Xander character ever conceived of in canon *or* fanfic.

The only way it could work if it was revealed Xander was no longer brainwashed. But then I exaggerated a lot by saying "could work" because as you said 'sexuality retcon.'

Buffy having a fling with Satsu, I can see happening, Xander with Dracula, I can’t. Joss has promised Buffy isn’t “gay now” and if he holds to that promise I’m fine with Buffy/Satsu because I couldn’t buy the idea Buffy suddenly turned gay this late in the series, unlike Willow who changed relatively early on and there was foreshadowing for that.

To me Buffy, who’s slept with bout a ensouled and soulless vampire, is someone who you could see hook up with Satsu when she needs to feel a connection, I can buy that. But I couldn’t for Xander, I’ve never seen him as sexually explorative as Buffy, which is totally fine, I’m not the kind of person who is either.

I’m going to put my money on it being Buffy/Xander, given the strong Buffy/Xander vibe practically all season when Xander hasn’t been around Renee. And if it’s a Buffy/Xander hookup I’d further speculate Satsu is the traitor which would get her out of the way.

[KingofCretins]

Actually, a double retcon, both with no legitimate canon foundation -- his sexuality as well as his feelings about vampires in general, and certainly about the dating thereof.

It would just be an asinine idea. I mean, if Joss really wanted to write "Torchwood", I'm sure somebody over there would have let him. He doesn't need to convert "Buffy".

Wolfie, that would certainly put a bite on such an encounter.

In a way, just to drive tension and drama for the main characters, it *has* to be Buffy or Willow, or to a lesser extent Faith or even Dawn. Because that could actually move relationships between the whole group along. Slashula would just be a crappy, BS gimmick, especially in the context Jeanty puts on whatever this is, a "hook-up".

If it's Buffy, for instance, I think it sets up interesting vibes with Willow -- she might be pissed on Satsu's behalf, and also a bit on her own. She seemed oddly possessive of Buffy in 8.03 when the three of them were together. There would be fall-out, is the point. It has to be a central character.

Scott Allie said that the last panel of 8.15 would be a big moment, and said it in the context of a Buffy/Satsu question, so it's possible that it's 'shippy in nature, and even more possible that it's Buffy-related.

[Wolfie Gilmore]

King - Faith would be good, imo. I'd love to see them both revisit their past treatment of one another. Faith, perhaps, ready to admit that Xander tried to be there for her and to help her even when she was in a mood to murder him in a kinky sexy way. And Xander perhaps would be better placed to see that Faith genuinely has changed - and that in the Giles and Faith team-up, if anyone was the bad guy, it was Giles, for asking Faith to kill people, rather than Faith. Perhaps a Xander/Faith hookup could even be a route to bring Giles and Buffy to some kind of peace? Or... perhaps even Faith and Buffy? I'd like that a lot - as a testament to Buffy's awesomeness, that she's in a place where she can forgive Faith and find a way to work together.

[Sacred Knight]

Awesome to see Xander getting a little bit of lovin' in some form or another, though I too am desperately hoping its Buffy. Anyone else just doesn't work for me. Willow is firmly in the girl camp, she has been for years, and even if you consider it a situation of consoling Xander's grief it wouldn't make sense that it'd turn sexual, not anymore. Dawn is at the very least plausible, but still, too soap opera-y for my tastes to have Xander hook up with his best friend's little sister, considering the history. Faith again is very plausible, but I guess just kinda on the boring side for me. But then again that could be in part due to my bias for Buffy/Xander. But it wouldn't be fair for me to dismiss it as not making sense either.

However I think Buffy makes the best sense considering the sexual tension clearly shown in past issues of this very arc, especially if its in a moment of Buffy consoling Xander over losing Renee, and in that moment of weakened defenses for them both their romantic feelings for one another break through, if even just for a moment and all they share is a kiss. I could see that.

Have Satsu witness this and it also gives you an opening to start a path to the dark side for her and start brewing some jealousy. A Buffy/Satsu moment of some sort we already know is going to happen, and there's nothing to suggest yet that this moment can't involve the formation of a love triangle. It would involve Satsu by association so could totally fit the bill. Yeah I know...I just said Dawn would be too soap opera-like and here I am suggesting a love triangle scenario with one side eventually going bad. I can do nothing but acknowledge the hypocrisy. :)

[LaJaula]

If it is Buffy that is Xander's new love interest, I really hope that, at most, all they do is kiss in 8.15. I mean, Buffy just hopped into bed with Satsu in this very same arc, and I really don't want to see her sleeping with someone else so soon.

Also, I'm kinda worried by the phrase "hook-up". It's implying that it's not long term, for whomever Xander is with, and I feel like Buffy hasn't really been in a serious, legitimate relationship in forever. She and Spike were never really an actual couple, nor are she and Satsu, so for her to go to yet another not-serious relationship seems boring to me. I want to see her in an actual, functional, healthy relationship with someone (or-- crazy, I know-- happy with being single). Xander, OTOH, is pretty serious about all his relationships, so if he hooks up with someone that's not Buffy, then I'm fine with it.

I'm hoping for a Xander/Dawn thing (what? I like them together), but most likely I think we'll get a Buffy-comforts-Xander scenario where she kisses him and Satsu sees, like Sacred Knight suggested. I would be fine with it if that was all it led to, but I do think that there's been a lot of build-up so far this season in the Xander/Buffy direction, so I have a sinking feeling that it could be more. Of course, Giles's storyline in Season Seven is proof that setup does not always equal payoff, so you never know.

[Skippcomet]

Of course, Giles's storyline in Season Seven is proof that setup does not always equal payoff, so you never know.

This is true. Also, you're correct that the word "hook-up" does sound like a one-time thing, or at the very least it becomes all about the physical. For all we know, Xander's hook-up will be with Vi the Vampire Slayer...or we might see whoever writes that scene try to outdo Joss and Goddard by having Xander "hook-up" with Andrew or Oz. If Faith weren't off who knows where with Giles, she'd be a possible candidate; same for Dawn and her giantness. Amy's off with Warren (and evil); I don't see Xander going for anybody he knows is a vampire (hasta luego, Harmony & Druscilla!); and virtually the only female character from the show's past who hasn't been killed, Slayerized, or in Hell-A that he's even been in the same room with is...Marcie the Invisible Girl, and last we saw of her, she seemed more interested in the psychopathic applications of invisibility that its salacious possibilities. (Has there ever been any Xander/Invisible!Marcie fic written, let alone smut?)

The only other possibility, IMO, is somebody brand new who we haven't met and who probably will serve either as a way to seduce (pun intended) Xander to the dark side OR as a one-time, ships-passing-in-the-night, one-night-stand.

[Sacred Knight]

"Hook-up" could be intended to mean that whoever Xander has the encounter with, the feelings won't be explored upon right away due to extenuating circumstances. For example, if for the sake of argument its Buffy, well we know the next arc has her jumping into Fray's time period. And this is a trip which, for all we know at this point, she appears to take alone. So, with her not even around the other main characters for the extent of this arc, it would be impossible for her and Xander to further explore what took place until she got back. Thus it could be, by force of other circumstances, impossible to label it as anything but a hook-up for the time being.

Not saying of course this is the path they'll go or that I'm even sure its Buffy, but its just an example of how Jeannty using the term "hook-up" doesn't necessarily doom this to be a one-time fling for Xander, whatever it may be and whomever it may be with.

[bishopcruz]

Also, to clarify, hook up is more or less my terminology, I didn't record my conversation with the guy so I am kinda going with the feel of the conversation. Also, I didn't get the impression that this would be happening NOW as in issue 15, but a little further down the line. The main things that I am SURE of from the conversation are that Xander will be getting some action in S8 and it is with a known character. Anything past that is pretty much spec.

I think Buffy is the one that makes the most sense, at least right now, but I think that with all the stuff going on the hook up is not going to happen in 8.15, actually I'm pretty certain of it.

I've been wrong before though (hey I thought Satsu was a red herring.).

[Matt]

I think Buffy is the one that makes the most sense, at least right now, but I think that with all the stuff going on the hook up is not going to happen in 8.15, actually I'm pretty certain of it.

I highly doubt it too, I mean, I'm assuming that Buffy and Co. manages to defeat the gang, or most of it, leaving room for somebody like Kumiko to return and also destroy the thing on the roof. Also, Xander dealing with Renee's death and preparing to kill Toru. But unless this continues past Buffy being in the future, it has to be wrapped up in this issue. I heard something about the castle being destroyed in Scotland, something major happening at the end of the issue between characters and obviously Buffy gets the scythe back because she has it in the future, so that's quite a lot to fit it, especially because it's the end of the arc.

BTW, does anyone know if 8.16 starts immediately with Buffy appearing in the future, if so that also has to happen in this issue too, I heard Vi was gonna be in it, because of the Georges Jeanty's cover?

[Enisy]

Agree with bishop that the only plausible options, at this point, are Buffy and Dracula. And honestly, I don't know which is the lesser of the two evils. Xander/Buffy would be a waste if it was just a hook-up, because we already have gotten a Buffy-centric hook-up in the form of Buffy/Satsu, and Xander/Dracula would be a trifle too Torchwood, like King pointed out. If this is to be a passing fling, like Jeanty seems to imply, I'd go for Xander/Dawn, but I don't think it's in the cards.

[bishopcruz]

I figure that after the Fray arc, we'll have some breathing room. Issue 20 starts a series of one-shots that I think will focus on different characters and allow things to percolate. I think it is very likely that Xander won't be in the next arc at all, or in an extremely limited capacity.

Again, a hook up might lead to other things, and in the Buffyverse it often does. Xander and Anya started as a hook up, as did Buffy and Spike. I think it's going to be hard to judge though, until we get a better feel of where the characters stand.

[KingofCretins]

I don't consider Xander/Dracula a plausible option, because of the, like, triple retcon it would require... all to accomplish something that would basically suck anyway and be nothing more than slasher fanservice with no ongoing implications to any character, really.

The preview pages actually put me more in mind of Buffy/Xander -- check out how she approaches leaving to go get Willow. Maybe the end of 8.15 will be Buffy having her own "Out of My Mind" moment about Xander, and we'll have to sit through "Time of Your Life" and 8.20 as the build up to doing something about it.

[bishopcruz]

The preview pages have her going apeshit from worry over Xander. I mean hardcore, I don't think I have ever seen her that worried for him since maybe Becoming. I still however refuse to let myself hope too much. Having been a fan since S1 they have ripped out my Bander heart many a time. I'll stay at best cautiously optimistic.

As for the Drac thing, that's what I assume will happen, and when it doesn't I can be pleasantly surprised.

[Enisy]

I didn't notice anything out of the ordinary in their interaction here, but I do think Xander/Buffy is the most likely outcome for this season and/or Season 9. Are you guys psychologically prepared for a Xander/Buffy romance in Jossverse? ;) I mean, I was like, "Yay, Spuffy!" in Out of My Mind, and then I spent the next 62 episodes going "Ouch! Ouch! Damn, that h-- OUCH!"

[Sacred Knight]

Also, to clarify, hook up is more or less my terminology, I didn't record my conversation with the guy so I am kinda going with the feel of the conversation. Also, I didn't get the impression that this would be happening NOW as in issue 15, but a little further down the line. The main things that I am SURE of from the conversation are that Xander will be getting some action in S8 and it is with a known character. Anything past that is pretty much spec.

I think Buffy is the one that makes the most sense, at least right now, but I think that with all the stuff going on the hook up is not going to happen in 8.15, actually I'm pretty certain of it.

I've been wrong before though (hey I thought Satsu was a red herring.).
In a situation like this, I'd go back to a previous hope I had, in that the end of 8.15 would show Buffy share a tender moment with Satsu, all seems well, then with Buffy and everyone else off-panel we the readers find out Satsu is a mole. But like you, I've been wrong before...actually I don't know if I've been right yet on one of my season 8 predictions. Ouch. :cutecry:

[Michael]

I would deeply appreciate the earliest possible and most possible spoiler information about #16 and the Time of Your Life arc. Suspense is just bad for me

I am fascinated by the King's idea that Twilight is Riley. Could he expand on this?

[Koos]

I still have glimpse of hope that Xander will hook up with Faith. But considering current circumstances I will be happy with Xander/Buffy. I think you could say that there has been some building to that possibility this season. But if Xander needs to get evil or bad just so that Buffy would be interested in him then I say: NO!! If Buffy falls for Xander than she needs to fall for him. The way he is. The good person he is.

[Michael]

I have nothing against Xander , but I have always felt sorry for him. He has courage,which commands respect. But would it be plausible for Buffy to fall in love with him now after knowing him for nearly eight years? Does it ever happen that way?

Moreover, Buffy is a demanding and devouring lover. Angel and Riley and Spike will all testify to that. Could Xander cope if Buffy fell for him?

[KingofCretins]

I think he could... because he's known her for that long, too. Closer to 9 or 10 years, actually. Spike, Angel, and Riley were all pretty thoroughly under this glammer Buffy has wherein they invest in her upward and downward melodramatic changes. Xander built up an immunity as her best friend that I think could have him capable of defending himself against emotional devouring.

Now, if you mean sexually devouring and demanding... hey, he was able to cowboy up for one Slayer (who still thought enough of it to kinda brag on it four years later) and an 1100 year old ex-demon. He ain't nervous in the service :)

[Sacred Knight]

. But would it be plausible for Buffy to fall in love with him now after knowing him for nearly eight years? Does it ever happen that way?
Sure it would be plausible. Necessary? Certainly not. But there definitely would not be an oddity in the slightest bit in the idea that someone she considered a friend for years has suddenly become more in her eyes. Long-time friends becoming lovers is certainly not uncommon in real life.

[Charles]

Ummm, newbie lurker just delurking to say I think Koos is right and it's Faith we'll see hooking up with Xander. I say this because:

-We know we'll see her again, probably even quicker with a reference to high school coming back.
-Faith and Xander already have a history of sorts to explore and deal with which may or may not play a larger role in Xander's overall seasonal storyline (if he has one).
-Faith fits the term of a 'hook-up' better then Buffy does IMO, she's much more likely to be open to one night stands based on what we know of her character.

Maybe it's just me but it doesn't seem like the right time or idea for Buffy/Xander. Them hooking up as it were, would have long lasting reprecussions for both characters and everyone around them. I mean it'd be looked as a major move for them and not just a hook-up which sounds like a one night stand.

And I don't think Buffy/Satsu is over with yet. Not with Joss's prior history of dragging out relationships and keeping them around. I think we'll see Satsu again here after Buffy comes back from the future and they'll be involved again. Only this time Buffy will be portrayed as being 'ready' for a relationship with another woman.

That's just my .02, the only other candidate that it might be is Kennedy simply because we know she's coming back and her personality is very similar to Anya and Cordelia's. She also has a yet undefined role and may have issues with Willow. I do think that if and when Xander does hook-up, it may give people another hint into his story-arc this season, assuming he gets one.

[NileQT87]

i'm thinking that if we do see a character from ats pop over into season 8... i bet you it is going to be a cop-out with angel and/or spike making an appearance in the high school era of buffy. being that the animated cartoon, which the whole issue is based on, is supposed to be episode 1x07.5 + dawn in the continuity, that means angel.

i'm about 90% sure that the ats crossover is going to be season 1 angel. the other 10% is that it's season 2 or 3 angel. and if season 2 angel, they'll pop spike and drusilla in there. if they want to make me super happy, it's season 1 angel and a cameo from darla.

[KingofCretins]

I don't think Joss is going to do a cop-out crossover. The Scoobies' reaction to "Not Fade Away" has been almost as desperate a curiousity amongst fans as what happened to the people that fought in the alley, and he knows that. He's not going to simply NEVER address it, it's ludicrous.

But, that said, I've become basically convinced by recent events that a Spike and/or Angel appearance is a rigged game -- anything not satisfactorily 'shippy is going to be treated as an insult to the fans, and the pitchforks and torches will come out (I think this is less likely the case with Buffy/Angel fans, because they are used to post-'ship crossovers, but they still want some 'shippy continuation more than they'll admit). So more-fencesitting, Buffy going "I choose me", or Buffy being with someone else and not ditching them for Spike and/or Angel... it's going. to start. a war.

[NileQT87]

or... in the not-so-evil-'shippers way... it's me just saying that the very idea of the animated series was based upon the idea of filling in episode 1x07.5 + dawn. thus, if the episode mostly takes place in that timeframe, seeing angel fills in perfectly with the timeline. it's just a matter of when the animated series was supposed to take place, plus the spoiler that an ats character is going to appear soon (and me doubting it is harmony or drusilla).

i think it's perfectly understandable if the hinted spoiler of an ats character is in a flashback tribute to the animated show. it's a tease without actually having anything about post-not fade away.

the drusilla rumor was because of the dress on the girl standing next to harth--who didn't look at all like drusilla (the girl looks like amy, imo--and i'm not saying that only because harth looks like warren. the girl really looks like amy in the face. drusilla has a much skinnier look.).

as far as bangel vs. spuffy 'shipper wars... if it ever does get resolved (possibly unlikely), it will be probably the end of season 9 btvs. as a bangel 'shipper, i don't even really expect anything but more vagueness. and yeah, i think you're right about how bangels are used to the multiple reunion appearances--roughly once a season--and spuffies aren't.

i'm plenty happy with the angel-ending-up-with-connor outcome (i'll just toss in some darla hope, while i'm at it).

however, i think angel and spike need to deal with drusilla before they deal with buffy.

nevertheless, i don't think we'll see anything with angel and spike in the CURRENT timeline until angel: after the fall is over. flashbacks in the animated series tribute are probably the most likely. they were both--especially angel--a major part of buffy's high school timeline.

[Koos]

But would it be plausible for Buffy to fall in love with him now after knowing him for nearly eight years? Does it ever happen that way?

Wouldn't be the first time. I have seen it a couple of times.

I think it is important to notice that Xander in S1 was in no way a competition for Angel. But the Xander from now is not the Xander from then. And I think Buffy still sees him as S1-Xander. If that will change, I'm not sure of though. Maybe it different, because, well, she simply doesn't see him standing. She's been dreaming about him though.


Moreover, Buffy is a demanding and devouring lover.

Devouring?


Ummm, newbie lurker just delurking to say I think Koos is right and it's Faith we'll see hooking up with Xander.

I hope so.


-Faith and Xander already have a history of sorts to explore and deal with which may or may not play a larger role in Xander's overall seasonal storyline (if he has one).


I think this was THE reason why Xander and Faith would not hook up. Definitely it was the reason in S7. It makes things complicated and I'm not sure Joss would want that.


Faith fits the term of a 'hook-up' better then Buffy does IMO.

I agree.

[Skippcomet]

-Faith and Xander already have a history of sorts to explore and deal with which may or may not play a larger role in Xander's overall seasonal storyline (if he has one).

The problem with that scenario is that thus far, Joss and Co. have shown no interest whatsoever in that history or in exploring it. And really, let's be clear on what that history actually is -- Xander lost his virginity to Faith while she was in a post-thwarted-slay funk. Later, he tried to reach out to her after she accidentally killed Finch and tried to pin it on Buffy, but she mocked his sincerity of intentions, came dangerously close to sexually assaulting him, and tried to kill him. A year later, while in Buffy's body, she made a snide and cutting remark about Xander's sexual stamina. That's...it, really. We've seen no real interaction between the two since then. We've seen no real interest from either Xander or Faith in talking to each other, let alone addressing the events of Season Three that took place in her motel room.

There's also the fact that Faith is off with Giles god knows where, presumably focusing on their "social worker for wayward slayers" mission. They don't seem to be in contact with the Scotland Castle bunch, so I don't see how they would find out about recent events like Renee's death or how Xander might be dealing with it, let alone why Faith would care to visit him about it. I think fans focus so much on what they want to see happen between Xander and Faith that they forget that the necessary groundwork for it simply isn't there yet.

the only other candidate that it might be is Kennedy simply because we know she's coming back and her personality is very similar to Anya and Cordelia's. She also has a yet undefined role and may have issues with Willow.

Kennedy may be many things, but I don't think she's really that similar to either Anya or Cordelia. Plus, it shows quite a dearth of imagination to suggest that anybody Xander hooks up with must have a similar personality to Anya or Cordelia, IMO. And there's the fact that Joss pretty definitively established her as a lesbian -- whatever her issues with Willow might be (if she does have any), I seriously doubt she's going to deal with them by suddenly showing an interest in men, much less Willow's oldest male friend. That would seriously throw a wrench into not just the W/K 'ship, but also the W/X friendship. Plus, it would dredge up memories of the Clothes Fluke in both the characters and the audience, and we all know who bore the brunt of the blame for that, right? Do we WANT Xander to be hated again?

[Sacred Knight]

I certainly wouldn't scoff at the notion of Faith and Xander hooking up again, I mean, she's no longer evil so its all good on that end (they would be forced for them to explore the season 3 events though). However Skip makes an excellent point in that Faith simply isn't around right now, and without any indication on when or even if she may be joining the castle fold, I put her in in the "slim to none" category. That could change at the drop of a hat if they reintroduce her soon of course, but until that time, where we're standing right now I can see only two options, Buffy or Dawn.

[Charles]

I agree that Faith not being around right now is a good point.

However the key word(s) are 'right now'. We don't know if or when this supposed hook-up will happen. We can guess that it will take place post #20 which is enough time I imagine for Joss and company to bring back Faith and Giles into the fold for whatever reason.

Now them not wanting to talk about or deal with Faith's history with Xander on the tv show is also important. However, the comics thus far have done things that wouldn't or couldn't have been done on the show as well. Giant-Size Dawn, Buffy's latest relationship, Dracula, etc... So with that in mind, I don't see how what happened on the TV series or rather what didn't happen, would serve as a major deterrent for something happening in the comics.

As for Kennedy Skipp, she's strong-willed and tends to go after what she wants. Beyond that, we don't know how she'll be depicted in the comics. Remember Buffy NEVER showed any interest in women before the comics either. We don't know how or what Kennedy will be like now, especially since she's had a mystical death of her to deal with. She would have another reason to choose Xander since he saved her before-hand at the cost of his eye.

All of Xander's love interests have been fairly strong willed women who know what they want and seek it out. Even Renee, she's the one that went after Xander, not the other way around. I just don't see that with regards to Buffy right now. She tends to prefer her partners to pursue her, I don't see her initating a relationship with him now even if she weren't still involved with Satsu.

I don't want Xander to be hated Skipp, but I do want him to matter somewhat. I don't think he really has, even this past story arc seemed more about Dracula then about him. If they're going to go down the path of Xander falling from the ranks of the good guys or pulling a Wesley, etc... I'd like to see them embrace that decision whole-heartedly and don't half step it like they did with Willow.

[Thomas]

Well, I just read an interview with Joss and according to him, Oz will be back and now we know when...Following that big twist yet to be revealed, there will be an arc with Oz — yes, Willow’s ex-boyfriend/werewolf is back — written by Buffyverse alum Jane Espenson. "This is the first time I’ve said anything about that," Whedon revealed. "It’ll be less stand-alone than the Brian K. Vaughan/ Faith one, but he’s the central figure."SOURCE (http://www.mtv.com/movies/news/articles/1590279/20080701/story.jhtml)

[Charles]

Other important stuff buried in that article:

-Naked Willow (I guess with Kennedy coming back, that door is now open.)

And Joss's comments on the Fray arc and it's overall impact were just as revealing if not more so. Especially that last question he asks when talking about.

[Charles]

Okay some additional thoughts now that I've digested that article as well as #16's information. This is all just my opinion so take it for whatever it's worth.

I said earlier that S8 was more or less, a rehash and mix-up of S4-7. And just by the latest information, I see no reason to not believe that. Right now for example, there is a very striking parallel going between this season and S6.

S6 basically revolved around Buffy, Willow and Spike. The other characters, Tara, Dawn, Anya, Giles, Xander and even the Geek Trio stepped in and out as needed. Sometimes a storyline thought to be about them, instead was used to prop up the main, ie Anya and Xander's wedding being used to reinforce Buffy and Spike's relationship.

S8 thus far has mostly revolved around five characters, only four of whom we really know much about or have clues about. Buffy, it's her book after all and she's the main character. Willow and her oh so sad secrets that have been touched upon. Dawn and her mysterious transformations. Twilight because he's the titular big bad after all. And Xander who's life keeps getting worse and worse.

Now IMO, just like S6 (and to a lesser degree the other seasons) a few of those mentioned will be repositioned as supporting pegs for the main storyline conflict. And for my money, the two characters whose stories I expect to get that treatment are Willow and Twilight because neither jives with what's going on with the rest of the season. Willow has a secret yes, likely a very dark and nasty secret but it's highly unlikely to play a role in resolving this year's big fight. Twilight while he may seem like an uber baddie right now, seems (like the Geeks) somewhat cartoonish. Yes he does author some absolutely horrorific events and attacks but he's doing so, a bit early in the season. It's nothing new for the home base to be attacked and destroyed (see the Library, Magic Shop, Buffy's house, etc...) but doing so early plus the more focus on the twilight symbols as opposed to him, suggest he's not the ultimate villian here.

So that leaves us with three. Starting with the most obscure yet probably simplest, we have Dawn who's transformed twice now. From Giant to centaur, her final transformation I suspect will play a role in the outcome of the season in addition to serving as the metaphor people suggested it has. However, I think in light of recent events, especially Joss's latest interview, it's highly probable now that Dawn is the betrayer. Why do I say this? Because she's the only one who's really lied and it's such a seemingly minor lie (all things considered at present) that has been hinted at as Buffy's undoing/betrayal.

How that could be paid off is anyone's guess but I would point out. That Dawn was made from Buffy. If someone wanted a really good strong sample of what makes Buffy Summers slayer, tick, Dawn would be a very good choice to start.

With Dawn out of the way that just leaves Xander and Buffy. Now Xander has had a bad year and it's getting worse. People he either loved or cared about are dying by the droves. In S6, Magick was Willow's vice and while it ultimately drove Tara from her side and later indirectly cost Tara her life. It also led to Willow trying to destroy the world. But it took Willow a while to get there and in that time period, she got 'better' for a little while and even enjoyed some happiness again. Then came Warren.

So back to Xander for a second. I have no doubts that Joss can and will find more ways rachet up the angst and pain Xander is feeling. Renee's death was the first step to that. The destruction of his new home and likely death of all those inside is another. Now we know he's going to experience a bit of romance later on the season leading to some oh so brief moments of joy, just like Willow got Tara back briefly. And at some points, three very big shoes are going to drop:

1)Cordelia's death which as far as I know hasn't been acknowledged in the series. Alternatively this could be what Renee was going to tell him.
2)Willow's little secret is going to become public knowledge and he knows first hand what that did to her and him.
3)If Dawn is the traitor, he's been the one closest to her and that will sting deep.

What does this all mean? Well I'm going to predict somewhat vaguely and haphazardly that as the season winds down. Something happens and Xander finally snaps. And in the course of his snappage, he kills Twilight by himself. Not Buffy. Not Willow. Not Random Slayer or Willow. Xander just kills him in cold-blood. However in the course of doing so or because of that kill, the final fight will not be between Buffy (and whomever) vs. Twilight. Instead we'll get a variatation of what happened on Kingman's bluff. The question is who's going to be Xander when he isn't.

This is has all just been my opinion, my throwing stuff against a wall to see if it makes any sense. I hope it didn't bother or offend anyone as that wasn't my intent.

[Morrydwen]

http://www.newsarama.com/comics/080726-comiccon-dark-horse.html

Scroll down in there a little for a new spoiler on a big development in an upcoming arc...

I'm very interested in seeing how this one plays out!

(still relatively new to posting around here, so I didn't want to just out-and-out quote the part in question....yes, even though this is the spoilers thread. Always better to err on the side of caution!)

[vampmogs]

Here's the part of the quote Morrydwen is referring to, don't worry we won't get in trouble and welcome to the boards :)

Buffy Season 8 will finish up a crossover with characters from Whedon's former comic series Fray, then Jeph Loeb is coming on for a single issue that will pick up on a "couple of things they weren't able to do with Buffy." After that, Jane Espenson, who was a writer for the Buffy television show, will kick off a five-issue arc featuring stories by the show's TV writers. In the story, Buffy's world goes public. "Vampires become common knowledge and it changes everything for the slayers," Allie said. Following that arc, Espenson comes back for five-issue arc featuring Oz. Then Brad Meltzer will be writing five issues before the series wraps up.

Thoughts;

That's very interesting. It always kind of felt like it needed to happen at some point. As the battles got bigger and the stakes were raised, it always felt unbelievable that people wouldn't finally catch on to the supernatural world. So I'm relieved they've taken it to the next level, I can't wait to see how this unfolds for Buffy.

[Morrydwen]

Spoiler tags! Duh. Forgive me, it's very early and I haven't had my coffee yet!


Same here--it seems a little inevitable and I'm really interested to see just how it happens, and how the world reacts. Will it make it easier for the Slayers, or harder? Admittedly I'm also curious because I know this is something that'll be coming up in the Buffy RPG I play in, so I'm curious to see what the differences will be between our game and the official cannon.

I can't help feeling like there'll definitely be wannabe Slayers to contend with due to this--normal folk wanting to be supercool demon hunters now that they know about vampires! Great potential for amusement there. :)

[Charles]

Expect news of who Buffy and Willow are and their past and or present relationships to become big news as well. I'm expecting the return of Satsu at this point as well.

As well as more crap painting Men as holding down/back women a la S6 (again).

World going to hell isn't that unique for comics right now. Transformers is doing the same thing at around the same time.