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View Full Version : "Buffy's Boys" -- Ultimate Showdown Control Test



KingofCretins
04-10-07, 03:49 PM
I thought I'd introduce this poll as a topic to determine the 'ultimateness' of the Ultimate Showdown. The point here is explicitly *not* to debate Buffy/Angel vs. Buffy/Spike, but rather to place those 'ships in perspective against the rest of the fandom.

NileQT87
04-10-07, 04:16 PM
with angel... or heck, just make it a threesome and all the bangels and spuffies will be happy.

i like epic stories... most of the humans just aren't nearly as epic.

as for the human choices... i'd rather have giles (which she'd never go for) than xander or riley. i can say that much.

the "vampire in love with a slayer" irony was a beautiful thing. those were the best stories on btvs, by far. "it's not about right. it's not about wrong. it's about power." pretty much sums it up. the epic mythic story lines were the power of the show. no bangel, the show probably wouldn't have made it into the second season. and the second season would have been a whole lot duller without the forbidden romance/angelus plot line. without angel, i really don't think btvs would have made it. the demonology was based around him, same with the vampire rules... the whole vampire with a soul thing was CRUCIAL for how vampires were looked at in the 'verse--besides angel and spike.

it's one thing for buffy to have her scoobies, but that wasn't what made the story early on. that's not where the depth was coming from. angel, spike and darla probably had the most depth going on of all the characters. anya had a lot of missed opportunities because they mostly were using her for comic relief, except for selfless. as for humans, the only one to truly measure up to the characters (particularly the vampires) who had significant backstories was wesley. he was the only human to have enough character growth and depth to measure up to even angel and spike. giles had glimpses of it, but not as much as wesley. willow was done well in season 6, but her arc in season 7 was a total cop-out.

as for who buffy clearly has in her heart--well, that's angel and spike.

buffy's most selfless moments... that was early buffy. angel brought out the best in buffy, imo.

without the vampire boyfriend thing, i don't think buffy would be half the show it became, because its not the friends fighting monsters that made the show a greek tragedy. they were excellent plot devices for the 'verse to create itself. they added a strong sense of moral ambiguity, that through them, could rub off on other characters, but they pretty much did lead the plots for most of the show(s). buffy, in many ways, was a reflection of whoever she was with, because whoever she was with usually was the device pushing the plot forward (even riley). otherwise, you'd have a lot more creature of the week episodes.

KingofCretins
04-10-07, 04:20 PM
None of the parenthetical options are exclusive, they are just examples. If you are a hard core Buffy/Owen 'shipper, you choose the second option, just as Buffy/Giles or Buffy/Clem or Buffy/Willy or Buffy/Tucker.

Basically this is Spike and Angel vs. the field, with the field subdivided into different groups.

Personally, I hate to see Buffy throw her life away on one of the vampires. Epic out of context though they may be, both relationships run afoul of what we know that Buffy has always wanted -- to hold on to her humanity amidst being a Slayer, to have the things that 'normal' people have. She's a bit like Piper from "Charmed" that way.

For Buffy, that has in the past meant proms and being homecoming queen and having a year book photo. Eventually, it's likely to mean thinking about children and other aspects of *human* romance that would be manifestly excluded by being with Spike or Angel.

Wolfie Gilmore
04-10-07, 04:27 PM
I put someone new, though for the immediate future, by herself seems a good plan. Ideally I'd like her to meet someone say...two years after Chosen? With a few flings along the way. As she says in Older and Far Away...no good in being one of those people who can't make new friends outside their tight little circle. Exogamein baby! If that's how you spell it. Getting it on with people outside the tribe, I mean. :)

Pandora's_Box
04-10-07, 04:49 PM
I said a new person, cause if Buffy were real and a friend or family, I wouldn't think Angel or Spike would be good for her for all the good reasons The Mayor gave in "Choices". I don't really see any other on the show she could get along with, although I really like the idea of her and Andrew :lol:. No girl because...Buffy's not a lesbian!! And all by herself, maybe before Chosen, but now there is a thousand of slaers so I see no reason for her to be left alone.

selenspuffy
04-10-07, 05:06 PM
'Angel, or Spike' option is what I'd choose certainly. And I'd say Spike personally. I mean Spike&Angel are the two guys, which were ready to do anything, even die for Buffy _for real_ I dont actually believe that any other man would do such a thing -for their love for Buffy- . I dont want to discuss about Spike or Angel?, but one of them should be, cuz only they deserve it imo

kana
04-10-07, 06:12 PM
I'll pledge for a cookie dough option. I have no idea who Buffy should end up with, it really depends on what she wants or thinks she needs. People want different things at different times. In a few years it may not be about the vampires.

Finding herself could be a solo thing or she could date someone whilst finding herself (someone enjoying cookie dough), however I sort believe that Buffy isn't the casual fling type, at least in the series she seemed a girl who prefers affirming relationships to boytoys.

If Buffy were to end up with a female, I believe it would be because she connects with them on some level and she would question a little about what it means (based upon character history). While it's possible I don't believe Buffy would simply experiment with her sexuality, simply for curiosity sake but hey, you never know...

Also NileQT87, you will have PM.

Zack
04-10-07, 06:42 PM
with angel... or heck, just make it a threesome and all the bangels and spuffies will be happy.

...and we have a winnah! Since I didn't see the and portion of Spike and/or Angel, I chose being by herself - there was never really an extended period where she had a romantic/sexual relationship with a guy during the show and I am of the opinion that she should really find out who *she* is as a person before she shares herself with someone else, whoever that may be. Rather than defining her existence, I'd love for it to supplement herself (much like how her Slayerness took a less important role since there were thousands) so that she can ultimately be just Buffyrather than Buffy the Vampire Slayer or Buffy, the slayer who fell in love with (a) vampire(s).

Sid
04-10-07, 07:26 PM
Really don't see long term Bangel or Spuffy being a good idea. In fact, I always thought part of the appeal of those ships is that it was already doomed from the beginning. Then again, perhaps some people find the image of Angel devoted to an 80 year old dying Buffy cute or romantic or whatever. There's also the "shanshu" option for either one of the vampires, but "I'm human now and we can be together for the rest of our lives" is all types of suck, personally. And it's not even all that interesting.

Also, I've noted that both Angel and Spike are always ten times cooler when they're not involved with Buffy in some way. Noting the differences in how Angel acted when he was with her and how he acted when he moved away is flooring. I still to this day consider BtVS Angel one of my most hated characters, and AtS Angel one of my favorites. You have to be, like, the biggest sparkly fangirl ever to have enjoyed Angel more with Buffy than on his own. I do admit that Bangel was a huge part of making the show successful, but now that it's over, there aren't many pros in bringing it back, other than grouping them together for the hell of it.

Same goes for Spike. He lost a lot of the flavor and humor in seasons 6-7 that he flourished with in seasons 2 and 4. And I honestly do believe that (especially now that Spike has a soul and is evidently doing the hero thing) both vampires' lives are more meaningful without Buffy. Unlike a lot of people, I think that Spike on season 5 of AtS was the return of everything I always loved about the character, and when I look at the chemistry between him and Angel, I really do NOT think he was out of place whatsoever. I even got into him socializing with characters other than Angel, but I digress...

One of the things that really slays me when I go back and watch season 1 and 2 BtVS episodes is how important Xander's role was looking to be, and how people have pretty much forgotten about that at around the same time the writers did. He's rarely considered for anything above others, and it's consistently annoying. I don't see why he couldn't revert back to his attraction of Buffy, and why she couldn't reciprocate this time. It's fresh yet at the same time back-to-the-beginning-ish, and it'd make for quite the interesting/potentially long term pairing. It'd be justice, too, unless I'm the only person who felt as though the Xander in the early episodes was meant to end up with Buffy.

BlasterBoy
04-10-07, 11:03 PM
Well, I have to say by herself. She is a much better character when she's by herself, imo.

My favorite Buffy was early Season 3 and 4! She was just so at ease with herself and calm, and just herself! She wasn't being tortured by boyfriends that destroyed her life, basically.

If I had to choose SOMEONE, it would be Xander or Riley, because at least she would be semi-happy with them. She already was happy with Riley, but then it went downhill :( So, one of those two if anybody.

ThePoet's<3
05-10-07, 06:50 AM
I said someone new (feels fellow Spuffy's rummaging in my wallet for Spuffy Membership Card back...) only because - I think Spike deserves someone "better".:D (LOL! I almost said Buffy should be "by herself". LOLOLOL!!!:roll: ) But I will support what Spike wants...and if it's Buffy - well she just better not break his heart!:(

Veverka
05-10-07, 07:32 AM
Well, I'm far from oposed to a little bit of Fuffy now and then, and Wuffy for experimentation's sake, sure. But at the end of the day, I think Buffy's straight, I really do. And I think Angel and Spike both had their moments... but somehow, outta no-where, I became a bit of a Bander shipper... not sure where it came from... just: that's what I think, for the future-y-ness :) .

alexa
05-10-07, 08:09 AM
Hmm.. this is hard because I have several ways of thinking about this. In the end I'd love her to end up with a human Angel, but I don't see that happening anytime soon..

I'd settle for Xander as well, the Bander idea is really growing on me, plus it would make for some interesting stories.

But then again I think Buffy (the show, not just the character) works best when she's on her own, or at least just as well in a different way. I don't buy into the Angel or Spike brings out the best in her. Buffy is the best heroic character ever written so far in my opinion, she doesn't always need a love interest. And that statement doesn't hold much cred on a Buffy fan forum, but I've done half a thesis on BtVS, I know what I'm talking about :p

NileQT87
05-10-07, 12:09 PM
if i had to pick a human love-interest that wasn't angel shanshued (lol)...

i'd pick (get ready for the bizarre choice): OLIVER PIKE!

i seriously think joss ought to bring back pike into the comics.

alexa
05-10-07, 12:26 PM
if i had to pick a human love-interest that wasn't angel shanshued (lol)...

i'd pick (get ready for the bizarre choice): OLIVER PIKE!

i seriously think joss ought to bring back pike into the comics.

lol, yes he was kinda cute! I remember when I was 17 and it first aired I liked them together ... but that was before the Angel episode ;) That's so funny that I remember that.
I'd still be able to get into Xander more though.

Buffy: Owen
Owen: Buffy
Xander: Xander

Dorian's Kitten
05-10-07, 12:50 PM
Had to go with the Angel and /or Spike option in hopes of it being AND! :D

But I have to admit Oliver Pike would be excellent. Joss should totally bring him back, but then somebody is going to have to point out (based on this new understanding of her first romance) that Spike was clearly her type all along: Compact yet muscular frame, pretty face, leather jacket, bad boy persona covering soft heart. ooh and the motorcycle!

Enisy
05-10-07, 01:37 PM
Spike/Buffy is my OTP, although I wouldn't be opposed to Spike/Buffy/Angel. Either way, I think Spike had a point in that Buffy needs some monster in her man.

KingofCretins
05-10-07, 01:49 PM
Yes... his point was to rationalize his desire to be with her.

I'm pleased to see it's, so far, barely a majority that would call the Spike/Angel debate the definitive one for Buffy's love life. I wish there was a way to control for the likelihood that preference to one of the 'devout' 'ships is more common amongst contributers to a fan site than amongst the general audience, since I would still guess the raw number amongst fans generally would be closer to 30 or 40%

Honestly, I have a hard time reconciling wanting Buffy to be with a vampire with even *liking* Buffy. In a literal reading of the show... they're vampires! In a metaphorical reading of the show... vampires never really correlate to the most upstanding members of our society. I'd never counsel someone into a potentially abusive relationship, for instance, because I think 'she needs some monster in her man'. *Nobody* does. I don't like to read the relationships on these shows in the context of romantic escapism and fantasy, though. I like the very realistic characters to be in relationships that would, in real life, be worth being in. To me, this precludes her being with Angel or Spike.

sueworld
05-10-07, 05:22 PM
I like the very realistic characters to be in relationships that would, in real life, be worth being in. To me, this precludes her being with Angel or Spike.

Oh dear you must have found quite a few seasons of Buffy to be a hell of a disappointment then! :lol:

As far as the whole Buffy/vamps attraction goes, I think it's logical really. She's a Slayer. Part demon as it now turns out from the info we got in season 7, so there's bound to be some kind of attraction there whether she realises it or not.

Also as Riley found out, she's a powerful women with powerful 'needs' that might snap an ordinary bloke like a twig if she wasn't careful. She can just let herself go with a vampire..on all levels. :lol:

KingofCretins
05-10-07, 06:21 PM
That presupposes that Buffy needs a vampire/demon relationship for total fulfillment and than uses the fact that she had those relationships to prove it.

If there was some element of being the Slayer that compelled her to need a vampire, there would be some history of Slayers giving in to that previously -- there's no evidence of this, and from the very first season, Giles at least reacts to it as an unprecedented idea. Likewise, we know that Kendra found the idea repellant, and that Faith (by far the most sexually adventurous Slayer we've met) was more than content with what humans had to offer -- her interest in Angel in "Enemies" seemed to have much more to do with Buffy than with Angel.

As for Buffy personally, I still don't buy it. There has *never* been *anything* in canon to support the theory that Riley and Buffy's problems had anything to do with her needing 'monster in her man' -- there was just Spike being a prick to Riley along those lines. That doesn't tell us anything about what Buffy or Riley feels. We know that Riley wasn't truly intimidated by Buffy being the Slayer. The only time he had a problem was in "Out of My Mind", and he was under some pretty considerable influences. Riley and Buffy failed to connect in a very human way, in that she didn't open herself emotionally to him like he did to her, which has nothing to do with him not being a vampire. That she enjoyed sex with Riley goes without saying.

And, it's worth noting that in "As You Were", Buffy was obviously in a "Spike who?" place from the time Riley showed up in the Doublemeat to the time when his wife showed up. She never even heard of Spike when she thought she could try to get back together with him. What does that do to the notion that it has to be a monster and not a man for Buffy?

sueworld
05-10-07, 06:36 PM
Being a 'monster' got nothing to do with really. I'm talking about someone as physically strong and centered in 'magic' as she is. A Slayer is a supernatural creation, as is a vampire. Both physically much stronger then a normal human. I believe Buffy would always have to be on her guard with an ordinary bloke in case she ended up, well, frankly doing him damage one night!

But saying that I always thought Riley was the perfect match for her. Nice good natured, ordinary chap (well if you exclude the whole initiative, 'I used to work in a secret underground base' thing!)

Pity many folks out there found him a wee bit on the dull side, and so bang! It was bye-bye Riley.

Shame because in the 'real word' he would have been the best match for her. ''Fat grandchildren'' n'all.

Enisy
05-10-07, 06:51 PM
And, it's worth noting that in "As You Were", Buffy was obviously in a "Spike who?" place from the time Riley showed up in the Doublemeat to the time when his wife showed up. She never even heard of Spike when she thought she could try to get back together with him. What does that do to the notion that it has to be a monster and not a man for Buffy?

That wasn't about Riley at all, though. Buffy would have reacted the same way if Angel had shown up instead of Riley, because it wasn't Riley himself she was attracted to in that episode, so much as what Riley represented (her comparatively "normal", pre-resurrection life). It doesn't disprove Spike's theory that "the girl needs some monster in her man". I mean, Buffy has tried being with normal guys before (Owen, Scott, Parker, Riley etc), but the "two most important men in her life" are both vampires. I don't think that's a coincidence.

nester
05-10-07, 07:51 PM
I've always felt Spike and Angel were the most important men in her life, because of how affected she was by her relationships with them. Both relationships had multiple traumatic events in them. I'm pretty sure a case could be made that Xander's dad was the most important man in his life.

kana
05-10-07, 08:02 PM
That wasn't about Riley at all, though. Buffy would have reacted the same way if Angel had shown up instead of Riley, because it wasn't Riley himself she was attracted to in that episode, so much as what Riley represented (her comparatively "normal", pre-resurrection life). It doesn't disprove Spike's theory that "the girl needs some monster in her man". I mean, Buffy has tried being with normal guys before (Owen, Scott, Parker, Riley etc), but the "two most important men in her life" are both vampires. I don't think that's a coincidence.

I partially agree with that. I definitely think being with Riley also reminded her of 'The Fire'.

In that episode she sees Riley and sees Spike's actions and cannot continue riding the lines. She gets the fire back and realises she didn't need Spike to do it. She feels drawn to him no doubt but her feelings about herself are more important. Buffy as a moral being has often felt these feelings of superiority but her attraction to Angel and Spike seemed to happen under different circumstances.

On one level they are both attractive but is that all it is? She fell for Angel before he knew he was a vampire and her initial tryst with Spike was born out of self hatred (see CWDP). With all her men she has felt 'better' and this is an issue that's more important than the vampire thing.

Girl needs a monster? Spike plays upon Riley's fear that she likes her men dark. She certainly didn't seem as emotionally available to Riley as she was with Angel but that may be due to everything that happened with him rather than her feelings for Riley. Whether Spike's claims were true or not, they served their purpose because it only fuelled Riley's fears. People always question whether Buffy needed Riley well, when decided she did, it was too late. Ruffy fans among us (mostly comprising of my mum) state this means that Spike's claim was simply his own wishful thinking.

Buffy likes men who hurt her? Oooh controversial. But Spike had enough insight into self loathing and of course he realised retrospectively that Buffy self hatred fuelled her attraction to him. He also thinks it fuelled her attraction to Angel. But we must not mistake her lingering feelings for Angel for her attraction to the darkness of Angelus. If Buffy does feel superior, this across the board, not just about vampires. Under this idea, Buffy was able to 'whip' herself for this holier than thou attitude (something Faith picked up on) by torturing herself by being with Spike. She loved it, but she hated that she loved it. His vampire status was the thing that drew her in but not for the same reasons she loved Angel. It was that she could take out her self loathing and pain on this 'thing' this soulless non person. Unlike with Riley and Angel, she consciously thought Spike was beneath her, because he's a soulless vampire: the creatures she kills everyday.

When Spike gets a soul this changes. Buffy gets insight into her 'condition' and to her having the soul it what matters, it changes her. Her profession is not that she's attracted to the demon, but the man he could be.

NileQT87
06-10-07, 03:12 AM
could it be that buffy is attracted to not the "monster in her man", but the fact that angel was something both human and non-human... a human soul in a demon infected body. much like how buffy is, actually (minus the sicko within sharing it like a bunkmate). you also have buffy, who had just lost all her friends connecting with somebody even more friendless than she is. here's somebody who stood alone--who nobody (then) could relate to. kendra, faith and spike never really stood alone the way buffy and angel had to. faith and spike, in particular, always had somebody to measure themselves against--to know what to do because it had been done.

as for faith--you really think she wouldn't have jumped on angel or spike for a "long weekend" if they had let her? her original plan for trying to turn angel had been the "long weekend" one. and notice that the one person who never let her down was ANGEL. the only men who probably could get complete respect from faith were angel and wesley. wood, spike and gunn got some respect as well. but notice that she gave riley and xander NO RESPECT.

...and buffy was still in love with angel when she was with riley--and he knew it. he couldn't deal with it. spike was desperate enough as a "fool for love" to let it be. he knew why buffy had been able to love angel--because angel's soul made him a man rather than a demon, despite his body. spike learned in "seeing red" that it was more than passion that was needed to make love work--that the selfish demon could never understand real love.

wesley had an interesting take on angel's souled-self. he actually said that angel was a "good man" (and of course, holtz answers that "he's not even a man"). wesley also calls angel "noble", "good" and "quirky"--an ensouled vampire can a better man than a real man out for vengeance. with angel's dark experiences, he actually knows more about humanity and about being human than most humans. interestingly, a similar conversation happens in "peace out" between angel and jasmine: angel talks about himself as an example of humanity's freedom of choice and jasmine corrects him. but--both are true.

an ensouled vampire is both human and non-human. so are slayers. angel was focused on keeping buffy's humanity until he lost his own. he tried to give her as much of a semblance of a normal human life as he possibly could. he even left her, sacrificing his own happiness, because at that point buffy did want to be a normal girl, despite also wanting him. angel also needed to forge his own path--to not do things just for buffy. spike also learns this when he came into angel's group--he no longer is doing things for buffy, but because it's the right thing to do.

anyway, point is, a slayer has a lot more in common with an ensouled vampire than she does with an 'average guy'. if she did go with a human, it'd have to be somebody who wasn't a pushover (riley) and someone who could identify with her (in both faith's and buffy's cases--that was angel).

the two average 'good' guys were not respected by faith. all the others had a slight superheroic or dark edge to them (despite being human, even faith was shocked at how dark wesley was--faith didn't use wesley as a pushover in season 4 ats--she tried with wood at first, but he didn't put up with it). but the mayor and angel will always be the two most important people in faith's life because they were the only ones that ever treated her like she was worth something, and angel was the only one that never was out for himself (unlike the mayor), thus, "the only one who's never given up" on her--in her own words.

KingofCretins
06-10-07, 03:31 AM
Uh, sleeping with Riley and experiencing genuine unguarded *human* love and affection was basically the primary catalyst for Faith's identity crisis during his body swap. It terrified her in a way that nothing, not even Kakistos, ever had (and brilliantly played by Sarah). It's a bit disingenuous to just throw aside the entire encounter and say 'she didn't respect him'.

But that is a tangent. To the man point, a souled vampire is still first and foremost a vampire. You notice, Wesley nor Angel exactly had a comeback to being corrected about Angel's status. The reason being that he's *not* a man, he's *not* alive. Between "To Shanshu in L.A." and "Not Fade Away", Angel came back to the same place -- he doesn't have the connection to life that comes from simply being a part of it. His (and Spike's) soul makes him unique amongst his kind, but he is not human. He is a dead body animated by a demon and afflicted with a human soul. Buffy is a living human woman afflicted by powers from a demon. They are almost diametrically opposite.

And, in point of fact, nobody, demon or Slayer or regular person, has ever described Buffy or any other Slayer as 'not human'.

cheryl4ba
06-10-07, 05:43 AM
Neither Angel or Spike are monsters King. Not while souled. They are all fighting on the same side. Good.
Buffy needs someone equal to have her back. If that guy has super human strength, like both these guys, and can hold his own in a fight, helping to have her back...that's a plus.
Aside from the fact that there is something ultra romantic and dreamy about a vampire slayer and a vampire falling in love. I think what's most important is that Buffy gets who Buffy wants. After everything she has sacrificed, she derserves that.

KingofCretins
06-10-07, 05:51 AM
First, they may be more than monsters but are still less than men in a number of ways, and are always the first to say so.

Second... *what*? Buffy needs a superpowerful man to have her back? Way to undercut the entire premise of the series :) The blond girl really does need a superhero man to protect her.

vampmogs
06-10-07, 07:54 AM
I've always found the whole "Buffy needs a monster in her man thing" to really not make a great deal of sense given what we've seen with her, it is much more likely that this was wishful thinking on Spike's part because surprise, surprise he was a monster. Notedly, Spike later adds when he is done taunting Riley and the two actually have a conversation with eachother that he doesn't think he has a shot with Buffy, so this evidently undercuts what he said earlier; to some extent even he doesn't believe what he is saying.

Buffy was attracted to Angel on a physical and emotional level but fell in love with him because he had a soul, which was the part of humanity a normal vampire or monster lacked. She was able to love him because of his humanity, not because he was a monster. We saw Angel as a true monster and whilst it was never really explored if Buffy was still attracted to him, she was sure to move as far away from him as possible in that regard. Buffy was attracted to Angel's humanity, not the monster part of him.

I feel Ruffy's pain everywhere when people say that Buffy didn't care about Riley, especially when we have her running to the helicopter after him because she realised how much she cared about him. Xander asks her to think if she could love him, serious love and she obviously thinks yes when she runs after him. Unfortunately she got there to late, but monster or not Buffy wanted to be with Riley. In 'Out of Mind' Buffy states that if she wanted a guy with super powers then she would be dating Spike but she wants *him.* To her it didn't matter wether he was strong or human, what mattered to her about him was that he was a good person.

kana
06-10-07, 10:31 AM
Yes the Riley thing was interesting because she never got the chance to choose. We wanted to make it work with Angel and Riley but they both left, so I find it difficult to say that she needed her men dark because we never know what would have happened had Riley stayed. It was no less successful than her relationships with the vampires.

In any respect...cookie dough. Superiority complexes, first loves, self loathing, ambiguous support systems...Buffy had to contend with all this, but part of who you are is what you want and Buffy's figuring that out, so I wouldn't presume to know who is right for her if she hasn't even figured out what she wants.

vampmogs
06-10-07, 10:45 AM
Yes the Riley thing was interesting because she never got the chance to choose. We wanted to make it work with Angel and Riley but they both left, so I find it difficult to say that she needed her men dark because we never know what would have happened had Riley stayed. It was no less successful than her relationships with the vampires.

Good point, all her relationships have pretty much ended badly regardless of wether Buffy was with a regular guy or a monster so really this doesn't show that she needs some monster in her man. Buffy has tried to have a relationship with three regular guys, was willing and ready to have a relationship with a regular Angel. She actually said no to Owen because he wanted to get into her violent world, he wasn't the same ordinary guy she knew and he didn't know the risks. Interestingly here Buffy says to Giles "You, Xander and Willow you know the risks." So it wasn't so much about Owen not being "super" enough to handle her world but about him being careless, someone with an understanding of her world, regular or not, would suit her fine.

Then we have Parker who ended it with Buffy yet in a cut scene Espenson actually scripted that Parker was a reflex to the Angel breakup, yet, she still didn't end it a regular guy and the idea of a regular guy was making her very happy.

As already stated, Ruffy ended because Buffy didn't reach him in time. She wanted to give it another go and make it work, to tell him all the things she didn't get to say but he left.

Scott broke up with her because she was still in love with Angel, not because he was too ordinary for her. And well.. ended up gay. :p

Angel turned back into a vampire yet when he was human Buffy was at one of her happiest points in the entire series, the whole "I finally feel like a normal girl." IMO that is what she wanted, to be a normal girl and having a normal boyfriend made her feel like that.


In any respect...cookie dough. Superiority complexes, first loves, self loathing, ambiguous support systems...Buffy had to contend with all this, but part of who you are is what you want and Buffy's figuring that out, so I wouldn't presume to know who is right for her if she hasn't even figured out what she wants.

Which means really she should be on her own, unless she has figured it all out in the year and a half we haven't seen yet betweeen s7 and s8 which means she is baked and ready for Xander. :D

selenspuffy
19-10-07, 03:13 PM
We know that Buffy will never have a normal life, so according to that, we should choose smo from the past,like Spike:D they can try to have a great life together forever..why shouldnt they? They can try!!:)

GSR
20-10-07, 04:25 AM
Spike. I started off the show being a shipper for those two and I ended it that way. Mind you, I started watching the show in my early teenage years, but in the end, I still think they had the best chemistry and growth. It was really interesting to see their relationship evolve from being one sided, slightly obsessive to love. Now that sounds mushy, but if you saw it, you know it was far from that (especially in season 6). :)